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Circle of Despair

Many of us have followed with sadness the story of the California woman who was captured by sexual predators as an 11 year old and held for 18 years before she recently escaped.

As details of her horrific ordeal have surfaced, some have wondered why she didn’t take opportunities to elude her captors sooner. In response others have referred to the Stockholm Syndrome in which, over time, victims come to have positive feelings toward their captors as a way of coming to terms with their torment.

Am wondering whether there might be any parallel to the way some of us relate to God. I mention that because…

On recent evening walks, I’ve have been listening to a series of lectures on church history by professor Garth M Rosell PhD.

Have found his lecture on Martin Luther (1483-1546) especially compelling. Dr. Rosell describes Luther’s cycle of despair in a way that some of us might be able to relate to.

Here’s a short summary of part of Dr. Rosell’s lecture:

“Luther’s struggle was a different from St. Augustine (354-430) whose struggle was basically with his sensual appetites

For Luther the problem was  the sensitivity of his own conscience–his own awareness of his sinfulness…both what he did… and what he failed to do.

[Luther] describes [his struggle with sin] in terms of his life in the monastery. “When I was a monk,” he wrote, “I tried with all diligence to live according to the rules, and I used to be contrite, to confess, to assiduously perform my allotted penance. And yet my conscience would never give me certainty. I always doubted and said, “You didn’t do that correctly, Martin. You were not contrite enough. You left that out of your confession.” The more I tried to remedy a weak and afflicted conscience with the traditions of men, the more I found it each day more uncertain, weaker, and troubled.”

“Luther,” Rosell observes, “was caught in what we might call a circle of despair. To be absolved from sin, one needed to love God above all else. But to love God above all else Martin felt that he needed to know that his sins were forgiven. Otherwise he would only fear a wrathful God. He wouldn’t love a merciful Father.

So around and around this circle he went—never able to feel satisfied that his sins had been forgiven and that he stood in righteousness before God. He always feared that he had omitted something, or that his obedience was not complete enough…

Luther struggled for years and years. He sought help. He got advice. He talked to colleagues. They all assured him that he was a good monk, that anybody looking at him would have to recognize that he was doing what God wanted him to do. But he could not feel that in his heart.

He was afraid that [his faith/obedience] wasn’t genuine, that it wasn’t motivated out of love, but out of fear of a wrathful God.

It’s in the midst of that dilemma that Luther made the great discovery of the Reformation— The discovery of God’s mercy and grace”

Rosell goes on to describe how Luther admitted that until he discovered the forgiveness of God, he not only did not love God—but actually hated the One “who punishes sinners”.

Luther’s circle of despair was broken only when he discovered the great truth of the New Testament letter to the Romans: that “the just (i.e. those who are right with God)  live by faith” (Rom 1:17). In other words, God forgives us on the basis of our faith in what Christ has done for us—not on the basis of what we do for God.

Roselle’s summary of how Luther found release from his circle of despair resonates deeply with me. For me, the truth of salvation by faith alone in Christ alone comes into clear focus in chapter 4 vs 5 of Romans. There Paul writes, “But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness” (Rom 4:5).

That brings me back to the plight of the young woman and the Stockholm Syndrome. Is it possible that the “positive thoughts” that some of us have toward God are born out of our fear of him– rather than being a response to his overwhelming love and kindness toward us–in Christ?

While there is certainly a time for fear– without an awareness of the inexpressible love and rescue of Christ, we are apt to feel the same circle of despair and– at best– dutiful, desperate attempts to please an unreachable God– that pushed Luther to the edge of madness.


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57 Responses to “Circle of Despair”

  1. SFDBWV says:

    It is interesting how many of us can’t quite grasp the concept of “grace”. Freely given, freely recieved.

    There is no greater relief than knowing, that my sins are forgiven me. Not through any deed or action of mine but through the deed of the cross, and the action of sacrifice Jesus accomplished for me.

    Yet there is another freedom most need to find along with Christ’s gift.

    To forgive…..Finding forgiveness in your heart for wrongs done to you, will release it’s grip on you and set you free.

    This is the peace that Jesus offers, free of guilt and unburdened by the weight of unforgiveness.

    This may seem difficult for some, but through the transforming power of the Christ, nothing is impossible.

    34 degrees here this morning.

  2. HeartforHim says:

    Thank you, Mart, for your very timely thoughts. I have been in a similar “circle of despair” feed by shame, guilt, and unforgiveness for a very long time. I so relate to Luther’s struggle.

    I am grateful for your thoughts.

  3. sjd says:

    Part of the New Covenant that is so New and needs to remain so New, is just what you are talking about!

    We need to understand the full release that God has granted us through His complete forgiveness, by His perfect once for all sacrifice on the cross. Simply receiving His perfect gift by faith. Because of Jesus’ precious blood, I am justified alone, made right with God, at peace with God.

    “But, it can’t be! I must do something! He doesn’t know what I have done. I must perform well!”

    NO, NO, NO, NO.

    Not by works of righteousness which we have done………..

    I pray that as Luther began to understand this grace, that you and I will continue to grow in it, and it will remain NEW!

    Mart, thanks for the NEW reminder this morning.

  4. Loretta Beavis says:

    Please clarify “fear.” Are we after discussion of fear as awe, respect, or terror, expectation or experience of suffering, what? (OT “yirah?”)

    Lab animals are put in a cage (dog) and shocked every time they touch the walls trying to get out. Eventually they stop trying, then when the cage is opened, they won’t even leave (why abuse victims keep going back to the abuser). An abuser says “you will have to give to get … .”

    (The kidnapped child was a prisoner, slave, treated like an animal.)

    Looking at Niagra Falls is awe-some, or standing at the edge of the Grand Canyon; sillies that cluster on a beach to “watch” a hurricane come in … .

    I have lived the circle of despair in more than one aspect of my life. Still struggling with one, but waiting on God.

    I’m so grateful for a God who says He will remember my sin no more. Not, forget (like “can’t recall”) but doesn’t keep shoving them in my face. I learned it’s the spiritual warfare of satan, the accuser of the brethren, who wants me to doubt Jesus’ sacrifice and resurrection and coming kingdom.

    I love my awesome Jesus!

  5. foreverblessed says:

    Thank you for bringing up Maarten Luther. He was a great inspiration for me.
    I was like him, on a treadmill of doing and doing.
    Untill I realised that we do not have to do anything, but to believe in the One,
    sent from God.
    Believing in Jesus sounds so vague. What do you mean, just believe?
    Believe, and then what, what do you do?
    It was for me a puzzle, while being a christian. I was keeping days, and annual Holy Days too. But untill I found out that we should not keep a day holy, but bow to the Son, give up our life to Jesus, say
    -Jesus, I am not my own master anymore, You are My King,-
    did I understand Maarten Luther.
    It is easy to follow a line of rules, this you must do, and this and this you must not do. So it seems, but it is so unfulfilling after a few years of doing and doing.

    The bible verses that follow came to speak to my heart:

    It is all about us coming to rest. Rest from our own works,
    and start believing in Jesus, really believe that you have been forgiven.
    And do not go back to your own works. Hebrews 3 and 4 I read a lot.
    Hebrews 4: 10 for anyone who enters God’s rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from his.

    Rest from our own works.

    So it is called Today,
    everyday we are in Christ, we are in the Sabbath.

    This is already spoken of in Isaiah 28 verses
    11 Very well then, with foreign lips and strange tongues
           God will speak to this people,
     12 to whom he said,
           “This is the resting place, let the weary rest”;
           and, “This is the place of repose”—
           but they would not listen.
     13 So then, the word of the LORD to them will become:
           Do and do, do and do,
           rule on rule, rule on rule;
           a little here, a little there—
           so that they will go and fall backward,
           be injured and snared and captured.
    When we do not rest in faith in Jesus, then the bible will become to us a book with a set of rules. Things to do, and not to do.
    Or otherwise we will make a new set of rules, structures to live by.
    The list -but also in the blending of many spiritual notes, facts, and principles: – in the topic of Symphony, can also be used as a set of rules, and that is not what is meant by them, they are there as a promise: we will become these things (the fruit of the Spirit) when we follow Christ in faith.

    But encourage one another as long as it is called Today… Hebrews 3:13
    Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest Hebrews 4:11

    I want to say, that I still find it a struggle to stay in the rest. I must stop myself often, and fall back in faith to Jesus, start praising Him.

  6. poohpity says:

    I wonder if at the time of Luther, how many of the common folk even began to read the bible. I think it is wonderful that God always makes a plan for revelation of Himself to those who sincerely look for and to Him. Luther opened the eyes of so many to the grace of God which changed the church. The church continues to change because we each can have our own bible and no longer have to go through the Priest to have a personal relationship with God.

    God had Luther do a solo so that the orchestra could grow closer to the conductor.

    I still feel despair at times struggling as to whether I am walking toward God or to my own path. One day the bible tells us that even our faith will disappear but there will always be love. If we do not understand the measure of God’s love for us then it will almost be impossible to extend it to others. Fear that that love has conditions on it we are not that free to give it away. God gave us love without the thought of ever receiving it back. Boy if we could do it that way.

  7. foreverblessed says:

    Maarten Luther’s life was not free from struggle after he came to the realisation that we are saved by grace:
    Sola Gracia, Sola Fida. (Only grace, only faith)
    He was hiding in Wartburg castle in Eisenach. On a visit there I saw his study room, where he translated the bible into the german language. And there is a spot on the wall, where Maarten Luther threw a pot of ink to sent Satan away, who had come to harass him.
    Maarten Luther was a new beginning, in a body of believers who were tied down by rules from the church.

  8. poohpity says:

    A lot of times we are held captive because we are ignorant to the fact there is another way. I have no idea what I would have done in that child’s place. I think that is why so many hold to the law because essentially it hold folks captive as well.

  9. BabyJ says:

    Hey everyone,

    I am wondering if it was the fear of God or the Fear of what God could do to Luther that motivated him. I guess I look at it like a parent/child relationship. Growing up my mom was stern, had high expectations, and enforced household rules on me. When I broke the rules, I was punished. When I disappointed her, she let me know where I had crossed a boundary. My fear wasn’t of her, I knew she loved me; my fear was of the pain (spankings) or restrictions she could enforce on me.

    As a child, I did not understand the rules. However, as I learned about the world around me, they began to make sense. The more I talked with her as a teen and young adult, the more I understood her thought process. Her rules were there to protect me and to ensure that I was contribution to society.

    I think the same idea applies to God. At first, he seemed to me like this all powerful judge. The fear was more of his judgment and hell. But as I spend more time with him, in his word, I am beginning to understand the rules aren’t there to keep me from enjoying life. They are there to help me understand what it means to be the light of the world. The more time we spend in his word, the more we understand what his salvation means.

    Personally I don’t see the correlation to stockholm syndrome…. I can’t say that I believe God is torturing us to get us to obey… Just a few thoughts, back to my observation corner.

  10. rokdude5 says:

    No doubt some of us were raised or indoctrinated with the fear or terror of God. In a way, that’s a good thing for some of us but as you said, Mart, it’s a starting point.

    Once we realized that we worship and serve a Loving God, then our fear of Him is the only thing we need to fear in this life. We will come to know that He is not a tyrant but a loving Father and wants us to come running to Him. Heb 4:16

    I think Martin finally understood that he doesnt have to be perfect in order to be righteous but rather God counted him as righteous by being faithful and being perfect isnt something he can do strictly on his own.

    How bountiful are God’s love and grace? It’s like every time I sinned, God has covered it by several folds! Of course as Paul queried, shall we continue to sin in order to receive such bountiful grace? Of course we shall not because as believers we should become dead to our sinful nature.

  11. daisymarygoldr says:

    Stockholm syndrome… what a tragedy when the victim sees the foe as friend! My prayer for them is that “God perhaps will grant them repentance, so that they may know the truth, and that they may come to their senses and escape the snare of the devil, having been taken captive by him to do his will.” (2 Tim 2:26)

    My relationship with God however is no Stockholm syndrome! He knew me even before I was formed in my mother’s womb. He called me by my name and proved His eternal love by laying down His life for me even while I was an enemy. He is love and He loves me for who He is not for who I am. It is because of His great love I am not consumed and for that I shall remain indebted to Him for eternity. Love casts away all fear and I do not fear the lover of my soul!

    …and it is the awareness of the inexpressible love and rescue of Christ that causes me to fear. My fear is that I am not able to give Him back what He has given me. My fear is that I miserably fail to measure up to His faithfulness towards me. My fear is that my human love falls short and does not completely satisfy the longings of His heart. These are not gnawing fears that drive me into a circle of despair. This is a healthy fear which motivates me to love Him all the more fiercely.

    As I wait for the return of my bridegroom, this fear actually keeps me alert and careful to not be tempted by the lures of this world… to not be enticed and deceived by evil men that may pose as the angel of light. The fear of God gives me wisdom and guides my steps so I may not go astray.

    Fear keeps me from getting entangled in the affairs of this world. It provokes me to not remain slothful but multiply and invest the talents He has given me. It cautions me to not build with hay, wood and stubble. If the night is far spent, this fear prevents me from falling into deep slumber…. to keep watching with oil in my lamp and to listen for the sound of the trumpet.

    The fear of the Lord also gives me understanding to practise harmony with my brothers and sisters…so some day in future we can present that grand symphony without discord. Must admit that sometimes fear of the Lord makes me anxious about my besetting sins. What if He suddenly appears and finds me with all my fingers caught in the cookie jar of sin?

    The fear at such moments turns out for good… it helps me examine and repent of my sins so that as the hands and feet of Jesus, I am able to show compassion with clean hands and minister mercy with a pure heart. Being sin-free, I will not be ashamed rather be fully prepared to meet Him with boldness. I really wished He would still my crazy fears by at least giving me a hint about the day and the hour of His coming but I know that He is one big romantic… who always loves to spring a surprise!

    Fear of God therefore, helps this bride of Christ to keep His gift of grace—the garment of her salvation spotless and clean, to guard her chastity and not lose hope but abide in His word, cling to His precious promises and stay faithfully committed to her very first and only true love who has justified her as righteous!

  12. bubbles says:

    Thank you, again, Mart for sharing your wonderful thoughts.

    we are all so blessed by martin luther whose heritage extends down to us many, many years later. we can thank the Lord that he had the courage to do what he did.

    someone once said that one of the enemy’s greatest tools against believers was that of discouragement.
    suppose the feeling/doubts that God doesn’t truly love us and forgive us could possibly fall under that category. . .

    Our Daily Bread has a lovely devotion this month called “Reminders of Love”. what an encouragement that the Lord put verses like “I have loved thee with an everlasting love” in His Word, because as humans, we tend to forget.

    perhaps one reason why humans struggle so with forgiveness is because God’s love is so huge and so perfect, it may be difficult for our human minds to wrap around it, and accept something so perfect. His amazing grace is just that.

    suppose motives can be thought as intrinsic–from the heart, or extrinsic–externally motivated by either a reward or to avoid punishment.

    one thing that stays in the back of my thoughts, however, is when i confess sin, what if i don’t remember each thing? especially before communion in church, we’re taught to partake of that with a clean heart, so i’ll ask Him to forgive any sins that i forgot to confess. while i’m truly sorry for disobeying Him, that is frightening, because that’s a serious thing. when God punishes sin, it’s the sinner’s choice to sin, and He deals with His child–He’s not out to get us. God is always good. like the Psalm says, ‘His mercy endureth forever.’

  13. bubbles says:

    DMG,
    we must’ve blogged at the same time. didn’t see your post until this one was posted. have been watching for you here.

    i’m terribly sorry for being snarky last week. :( it wasn’t acceptable. felt really bad all weekend-especially on Saturday.

  14. daisymarygoldr says:

    bubbles, please do not apologize. It happens to me all the time over here…and now I don’t even apologize because I have actually run out of my sorries. Regardless of what Bloom’s theory says, it is my prayerful hope that some day you will believe what the Bible says— a functional brain and its ability to memorize is a gracious gift of God. At work, we develop all sorts of testing methods to help many who desperately struggle to memorize. You are very much in my daily prayers, for God’s love to completely heal and fulfill every need of your hurting heart…

  15. poohpity says:

    bubbles,
    It takes a very humble person to apologize for the wrong we cause. It is very difficult to admit when we have harmed another with our words. That was a beautiful and loving thing to do.

  16. debla48 says:

    Perhaps the enemies that we have “bonded” to are the enemies of this world, the world, our flesh patterns, and the devil. From the time we are born, we have become accustomed to facing life as prisoners to these things. So when newness of life comes at the moment of salvation, we are free, but we do not automatically start acting like it. It is only by the renewing of our minds, which is done by spending time with the One who has set us free, do we truly understand the wonderful freedom newness in Christ brings.

    I can somewhat relate to Luther, I too can get trapped in a circle of despair, as I think Paul did in Romans chapter 7, but then in the next chapter, he learned what the secret was to having freedom in Christ.Paul asked “Who will set me free from this body of death?”(Rom7:24-25), answer from Jesus, “You will know the truth, and The Truth will set you free.”(Jn8:32) Who is that Truth? Jesus said, “I am the way, the truth and the life.”(Jn14:6) Finally, Paul realized, “Thanks be to God (who has rescued us from this body of death)-Through Jesus Christ our Lord!

    Now, by faith, we walk in freedom from sin and death through the power of the Holy Spirit. At first it may not seem natural, but the longer we walk and believe the truth of God’s Word, the more real our freedom becomes. Then we know the greatness of God’s love for us. “For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, either height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.”(Rom 8:37-39)What an awesome Love!

  17. foreverblessed says:

    DMG, read your post on the topic of fear.
    Just one thought:
    Isn’t it so that our natural love is just always falling short. Isn’t that why we have to rely in faith even more? Isn’t that why we have to attach to Him who is able to fill us with His divine love even more?
    Isn’t it that we have to let go of our own effort, but that we have to hang on to Him even more.
    The effort is in hanging on to Him.

  18. SFDBWV says:

    I’ve been thinking about the fear subject. Lots of thoughts.
    As far as the Stockholme syndrom. I remember reading that Joseph was sold into slavery and not only befriended his masters but saved them…Just a thought

    If you read or listen to todays politics you can see that nothing has changed from Luther’s day.

    Two main ingredients for control of people are,
    1. Information
    2. Fear

    In M. Luther’s time the politics of control was simple, keep the masses ignorant and filled with fear and they will follow along with out problems. Every once in a while someone would question that authority and so they would be burned to death for their action.

    If you look at art from Luther’s time and before, you see a gothic horror of hell and the devil’s imps. You see the tormented faces of the lost and the tormented.

    Art shown, what the people in power were showing to its people. This horror of hell and enless torment were awaiting any who disagreed with the doctrine of the church leaders.

    Fear was the education that Christian people were fed. Popes did not want the language of the Bible to be changed because then all people everywhere could read for themselves what God had to say.

    Generations of people grew old and died without ever knowing anything except what they were told by power people keeping control of the population by fear. Fear of a horrilble death if they disobeyed and then endless torment from an angry God as well.

    No wonder Luther was affraid of not pleasing the God he had been taught about.

    But…there is life changing power in the Word of God. Christ was moving and motivating believers. His light could no longer be kept under the basket. Freedom was bursting forth from the written word. And could no longer be contained.

    It took great courage for Luther to go up against the power of the Pope. But he took the task for Christ, and was willing to die for Christ’s work. Many un named Saints did die during this time.

  19. SFDBWV says:

    How then do we relate to God? Where is fears place in our relationship?

    Christ said he now calls us His friends…

    I can agree with Daisy in that my fear is to not be what God wants me to be, to fail Him, perhaps even to fall out of favor. The greatest fear of all, to be without God.

    Fear is often confused with respect. I can see a very clear difference. The fear of God is said to be the beginning of wisdom. But fearsome isn’t the only definition of God.

    As a Christian, I am free of fear from a wrathfull and vengefull God. He is now not only my Father, but also my brother and friend. We are family.

    If I err and sin, it is not punishment from God so much as the consequence of my sin that causes me grief. God will pick me up from my own failures and forgive me. There is nothing to fear from such a loving friend.

    Fear has no power over you so long as the Power of Christ lives in you. This Holy Spirit is with you forever.

  20. afranz says:

    debla4
    Liked your post. Seems that way to me too. Thanks

  21. afranz says:

    Oops, sorry. 48

  22. pegramsdell says:

    DMG, amazing post of healthy fear:

    “…and it is the awareness of the inexpressible love and rescue of Christ that causes me to fear. My fear is that I am not able to give Him back what He has given me. My fear is that I miserably fail to measure up to His faithfulness towards me. My fear is that my human love falls short and does not completely satisfy the longings of His heart. These are not gnawing fears that drive me into a circle of despair. This is a healthy fear which motivates me to love Him all the more fiercely.”

    also..very humbling Bubbles. I know that God will lift you up. :)

  23. foreverblessed says:

    To add to the other comments on fear:

    In the Old Testament names for God are Adonai, Elohim, they are words for a being who is fearsome, awsome, great and far away.

    In the New Testament there is a new name for God: now God the Father.
    Jesus came to introduce us to the Father, plus afcourse make the way to the Father possible.
    We can call Him our Father, and that is very close Being. A loving Father. One who cares for you. But also disciplines you, cherishes you.

    Fear in the meaning of great respect for a close Father …. Abba, like daddy.

    And a verse to it:
    Romans 8:15
    For you did not receive a spirit that makes you a slave again to fear, but you received the Spirit of sonship. And by him we cry, “Abba, Father.”

    And Vick, thanks for your comment, loved it too.

  24. bubbles says:

    very interesting thoughts. it’s so nice to read what others are thinking, learn from others, and bounce thoughts off others.

    what about this: was in the presence of a godly person several years ago. the comment was made to another person, “You need to obey God because you love Him, if you don’t feel like obeying God out of love, then do it because you fear Him.”

    when the Proverbs say ‘the fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge (wisom)’, does it mean we should fear Him because we deeply love Him, and fear disappointing Him? this is embarrassing, but i’ve never been able to exactly pinpoint what that means to full satification. when God is thought about–all of His attributes: omniscience, omnipresence, omnipotence, and immutability, and so on, shouldn’t that strike fear when we comprehend how much greater He is than us? knowing that He holds our next heartbeat and breath in His hands is in some ways to me terrifying.

    this fear has to be balanced with the knowledge of His love. but, look at Korah in the OT, or Annias and Sapphira. a huge motivation for me to study in college was the fear of failure, and wasting my parent’s money. the motivation wasn’t about learning, but leaarning took place in spite of the wrong motivation.

    but, when we really love someone, our motives are about the other person, not us, right? so, then, don’t we want to please God because we love Him? and just fear not honoring Him/pleasing Him?

    is this wrong? sorry for misspelled words. :( should have a dictionary nearby. ha. the fingers go faster than the thoughts come.

  25. daisymarygoldr says:

    Good thoughts, bubbles…

    foreverblessed, you are right, “natural love” is just always falling short. Natural love believes the lies of the enemy to doubt God’s love for us. Doubts like… if God is love, why is He not answering my prayers, why is He not healing my sickness, why did He let my children or spouse die, why did I lose my job or why did I fail…

    As you said, it is “divine love” that enables us to know that God’s very nature is love. It helps us realize that love was why He made and saved us. Being born again as His children, His divine love helps us to love Him regardless of whether it rains or shines because that is the very purpose of why He had created us in the first place.

    However, we must remember that God is Spirit and immortal (1 Tim 6:16) and my mortal flesh will always prevent me from seeing Him as He is. I if I cannot see someone clearly I cannot hang on to Him and my love for Him will be incomplete.

    So, with that limitation, I do love Him with all my heart, soul, mind and my spiritual strength knowing this for sure (i.e. “rely in faith”) that some day my human love will be perfected when this human mortal body will be transformed into divine immortal body (1 Cor 15:53).

    Hence, “My fear is that my human love falls short and does not completely satisfy the longings of His heart”. Hope this makes sense…

  26. daisymarygoldr says:

    “Luther admitted that until he discovered the forgiveness of God, he not only did not love God—but actually hated the One “who punishes sinners”.

    Not sure if I’m able to relate to Luther’s thoughts but personally, I cannot hate the One “who punishes sinners”. In the Garden of Eden what was deemed as punishment is actually something good which God did for Adam and Eve. Had they been allowed to stay in the Garden, they would have also eaten of the tree of Life to live forever…to never die. Imagine what it would be to live under the curse of sin with sickness and suffering for the rest of our lives…

    God in His loving mercy placed them outside the garden and provided them deliverance from the curse in the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ—the lamb slain from the foundation of the world …and today the punishment for being born in sin is death which is also a blessing in disguise. It is death which will deliver me from this mortal body to put on immortality and love God forever and forever!

  27. foreverblessed says:

    DMG, thanks for answering. Will go on with the thought:
    -However, we must remember that God is Spirit and immortal (1 Tim 6:16) and my mortal flesh will always prevent me from seeing Him as He is. I if I cannot see someone clearly I cannot hang on to Him and my love for Him will be incomplete. –

    This now makes me think:
    It is something put in me, something not part of my mortal flesh that longs to Him, that reaches out to Him.
    I find the concept of a Symphony beautifull, because I found out that when we are conversing here on the blog, or when I am with other christians, that later, when I am on my own, in my room, this “Something in me” starts to reach out to God. I know then that others are praying for me, as I am praying for other people, and God blesses it, and gives us of His Love, and Joy, and Peace.
    Because, I from myself, in my mortal flesh do not have such great outburst of joy. It is given to me. And together we are a great Symphony praising God, in the Spiritual realm.

    There is a verse in the Bilbe that talks about it:
    You make the spirit in us long to You. Or the Spirit in us longs for You.
    Found it:
    James 4:5

    And what about
    Philippians 3:3:
    we who worship by the Spirit of God, who glory in Christ Jesus, and who put no confidence in the flesh

    Colossians 1:8
    and who also told us of your love in the Spirit.

    I want to emphasize that this is being given to me, no merit goes to me. It always happens after I have been conversing with other christians, so it must be the prayers or the being together in one accord in the Spirit which God blesses.
    Being a Symphony together.

  28. sjd says:

    Part of God’s amazing love for us is that we get to enjoy the promises of the New Covenant which include:

    A new heart to know Him. Jeremiah 24:7

    A new heart to fear Him. Jeremiah 32:40

    A new heart to love Him. Deuteronomy 30:6

    He places His Spirit within us. Ezekiel 36:26-27

    His law is written on our hearts. Jeremiah 31:33

    We now have the “want to” we never had before, and also the “Power”!

    It is so great we can praise Him together!

  29. dependent says:

    Bubbles, thank you for publicly modeling a Christ-like response to the conviction in your heart. It is unfortunately rare these days to witness a simple “I’m sorry, I was wrong” and even rarer to hear a simple “I forgive you” in response. You truly understand grace and I learn from that.

    SFDBWV, thanks for the pointing out the example of Joseph! Now there is someone who also understood grace. Perhaps Joseph, or Jesus, or Stephen would have been labeled by today’s ‘experts’ with a “syndrome” because of their response to those who persecuted them in very personal ways.

    I want to have the kind of “syndrome” where my response to those who persecute me, offend me, hurt me is one that says, “bless those who persecute you” and “forgive them, they know not what they do”!

    And that topsy-turvey way of looking at “enemies” can only come from a true revelation in my heart of the fact that I, as an enemy of God and His righteousness, was chosen before time to be forgiven before I ever realized my need to humbly bow and repent before my God.

  30. daisymarygoldr says:

    Great insights everyone! Been thinking about whether it is fear or love… or are they 2 sides of the one and same truth? Just like God is both law and grace…

    At one point of my life I had followed road-rules out of fear– fear of the police officers and fear of getting a ticket. My obedience to abide by the rules was because I feared the law. Fear never really made me to love the law and enjoy driving. However with maturity, I saw the rules in a totally different light. The law for me now, is no longer a burden that destroys life but is for my safety that preserves life. This “new revelation” of the same law liberated me from the fear of punishment to actually appreciate the dos and don’ts that now help me experience the joy of driving.

    …and fear? Fear actually motivates me now to drive carefully so as to not kill others or get killed. Breaking the rules (i.e. to sin) will cause death which then causes untold grief. Steve/SFDBWV, you are so right about sin that causes me to grieve. With that understanding, fear makes me to not hate the punisher/lawgiver but to love and conform to His law. This is not to merely fulfill the duty of a good citizen or to please the police officer, but now I love and follow the law out of a deeper concern to save life.

    It is the same with my spiritual life. In the beginning fear of God was more like a terror–fear of the punishment of hell fire. In fact that was the main reason why I had accepted Jesus as a child. Next, the fearful fiery indignation morphed into fear of falling into the hands of the living God. However, with spiritual maturity the fear of the Lord is not fear of punishment.

    Yes, to dodge punishment I had accepted salvation as the gift of His grace by simple faith. And it is by the selfsame faith I continue to work out my salvation in fear and trembling. What is that work? Is it to perform well and earn God’s righteous merits? Is it desperate dutiful attempts to please an unreachable God? No. the fear of the Lord gives me wisdom and knowledge to fully understand why He does not want me to drive on the wrong side of the road. This fear of a deeper concern… helped me to finally experience the joy of driving/salvation!

    My fear therefore, is the expression of my love–to love the God who gave the law. Remember the Law is the same but in Christ we now have the “true revelation”. Can I please and love God simply with an effort of faith in hanging on to Him? No… faith without works is dead faith. I have to make my own effort to steer myself away from the side of oncoming traffic. I make my own effort to stay within the right lanes and speed limit. That is how my faith in God is evidenced in the works of love, grace and mercy towards others.

    Lest I forget and lose all fear, because the old Covenant/Law has passed away, the spiritual red-light cameras of the “New Covenant”:) are effective enough to stimulate necessary fear to be cautious and concerned… This “new” approach to fear helps me love and please the loving desires of our God who wants that none should get killed (perish) but all should have life and enjoy life abundantly! Without fear love knows no meaning because “All truth is in tension” learned this right here from MDH (aside: really missing your Bible Ah-Ha! #s). Do we still see it as a circle of despair?

  31. pegramsdell says:

    I want to crawl on God’s lap and feel His arms around me and just squeeze him. Just saying I love Him doesn’t seem like enough. It’s very frustrating.
    I do fear displeasing Him, but more so I really do love Him because He first loved me. Always.

  32. BobbiLee says:

    There is a concept in the New Testament which caused someone to say, “Fear produces slaves, love produces sons”. I think at first when we come to Christ, it is a freedom we have never known. At that beginning though, obedience might have a little fear in it. I can identify with Luther in that respect. That might be the same cycle as domestic violence victims might find themselves in and also kidnap victims. Pleasing our “captors” keeps us safer, at least in our minds. It becomes in a way our comfort zone. Pushing “spiritual buttons” does the same thing.

    When Christ asked the man at the pool, “Do you want to get well”, we think at first that of course he wants to! Then, when we hear the man make many excuses, we begin to understand something about dependence on others and not taking responsibility because we are more comfortable there.

    It’s often difficult to step out of our bondage/comfort zone into the freedom that is Christ.

  33. xrgarza says:

    Mart,

    The question that you asked “Is it possible that the “positive thoughts” that some of us have toward God are born out of our fear of him– rather than being a response to his overwhelming love and kindness toward us–in Christ?”

    Well first of all I would question if they are even positive thoughts at all but simply fear.

    When I was younger I was born into a Catholic family at age ten my family converted over to Christianity, Spirit Filled Assembly of God to be exact.

    By the time I was twenty-four, I knew that I could not please my mother no matter what I did, right or wrong, good or bad, I later learned that mom was just an unhappy person. But I thought then, If I can’t please mom, God must have requirements that are much stricter than mom’s so therefore there’s no way I can possibly ever please God.

    So in my frustration at age twenty-five I denounced Christianity and all that it stood for and accepted the fact that when I died I would spend eternity in hell, because I knew I did not have what it took to be a goody two shoe Christian.

    Until five years later God showed up and revealed Himself to me and ever since then He has shown me who He is and He does not resemble the image that I had of my mother at all, nor does He resemble the people at the church that I attended that would try to scare me straight. As a matter of fact He resembled my mentor Jerry who to this day has never been a Christian, but I continue to pray for him

    I don’t know what Luther’s childhood was like and if there is any correlation with his insight and revelation, but I can see and understand his frustration, the Apostle Paul said that he was the worst of the worst. What was in him so profoundly that he came to this conclusion as well? Could that have been what allowed him to write most of the New Testament?

    Xavier

  34. Mart De Haan says:

    Xavier, thanks for adding your thoughts to such a good discussion!!

    Woke up this morning with the pressure of thinking that I owe you all another post. Started reading the different ways we relate to the fear and love of God– and found myself fed and so encouraged by your personal perspectives. Don’t want to cut this off.

    Thanks for giving me a good excuse to “take it easy” on this Labor Day Weekend.

    And daisymarygoldr, even though we sometimes seem to find ourselves looking across at one another from opposite sides of the same table, am so thankful for the privilege of learning from one another… at the same table!!! :-)…

  35. SFDBWV says:

    I am reminded tihis morning of a quote from Dr. Sigmond Freud, I read many years ago.

    It speaks to the difference of worldly thinking and the life changing power and pressence of Jesus Christ.

    Freud said that “people are doomed to repeat their mistakes over and over again, all of their lives, until death.” This is the “circle of despair” as the world of psycology see it.

    But….I know of a supernatural power, that can break this “circile of despair” and turn it into joy. “weeping may endure for the night, but joy comes in the morning”

    Jesus of Nazareth, this man can change you inside and out. Cause you to walk on the stormy sea, and to remove the mountains in your life.

    Break free of the cycle of returning to your grief and look up, for your redeemer is at hand.

    It don’t matter how others have hurt you, or what you’ve done to hurt yourself.

    It cannot compair to the Grace of Jesus Christ offered to you from our Heavenly Father.

    Enjoy your weekend off Mart DeHaan, you have earned it. Also a pleasent holiday to all.

    Steve

  36. xrgarza says:

    Bubbles Your post “but, when we really love someone, our motives are about the other person, not us, right? so, then, don’t we want to please God because we love Him? and just fear not honoring Him/pleasing Him?

    WOW! The hairs on my arm just went up I couldn’t have said it better; I never want to dishonor or displease my Lord.

    I raised my children by myself I never wanted to scare them straight but yet I wanted them to honor me. That’s when I remembered the golden rule. I had to treat them like I wanted to be treated meaning I had to honor them first. That’s what Jesus taught us when He washed the Apostles feet.

    I am going to wear this saying out, but we live in a fatherless society we have a lack of mentors. When Abraham Lincoln did away with slavery a lot of the slaves became bondservants and continued to do what they always did because that is all they knew. They were not educated and illiterate someone had to come along and teach them and we can now see the process of that initial action so long ago.

    Similarly, the men that God has brought into my life I have a responsibility to share God’s love with them but not out of fear that they will go to hell. The Bible tells me if I know what’s right and I don’t do it then it’s sin. I want to know that they see Jesus in me because God has taught me how to love myself He has removed my pain and I want to share this with the world but for now I will share it with every person that crosses my path.

    To be a successful parent, mentor, teacher one has to be more than willing to be inconvenienced.

    Bubbles one more thing: you said “sorry for misspelled words. :( should have a dictionary nearby.”

    You know what I do? I open a copy of my word processor and while in this little window I press Ctrl and “A” on my keyboard then I press Ctrl “C” I then go to my word processor and I press Ctrl “V” and let my spell checker and grammar take care of it for me. Yes then I then I do Ctrl “A”, Ctrl “C” I then return to this little window and if everything is still highlighted then I press Ctrl “V” and everything gets replaced. Just a little something I learned while at Intel.

    Xavier

  37. xrgarza says:

    Mart,

    Have a great weekend! As much as I enjoy this Blog as a matter of fact it’s the only one that I participate in we all need our rest.

    The Bible says, “That those that God loves He gives rest” And I know that He loves you. Enjoy the rest I know I will.

    God Bless you
    Xavier

  38. poohpity says:

    It seems that Luther as well as many others had to come to a point when what they were living was so uncomfortable that they sought a change. Nothing changes if nothing changes. Fear is an emotion that we are blessed with sometimes to prevent us from making a wrong action, sometimes it is of the unknown and sometimes it is a kind of respect because we are aware of the high position like with God. Fear can cause us to make a change, to run in the opposite direction or it can immobilize us.

    I believe it is like anything else that God bestows on us it can be used for good or evil. Emotions are part of the makeup of humankind and we were created in the image of God. Like anything else they teach us a lot of lessons if we are only open to them.

  39. bubbles says:

    Xavier,
    this is terrible. it will sound silly and stupid. you know who made me think about (when we really love someone, our thought/actions are always about the other person, and not about honoring/pleasing ourselves) comment? my dog. when we’re together walking, there are times when he looks up and smiles! he just wants to fellowship and be patted on the head. he obeys because he wants to, not because he has to. {sometimes he doesn’t want to obey. that can be difficult. ha.} bless his heart. he knows how to love. ha. told you it would be silly. Thanks so much for the spell check tip. it’ll be used next blog. may the Lord protect you in your truck. . and the other vehicles around you.

    Steve, thanks for your comment about Joseph in Genesis. very intriguing. never thought about it like that before. had always thought Joseph was just relying on God to help him have the right attitude towards Poitphar/Pharoah, etc. perhaps the Stokholm syndrome was in effect here. what a lovely picture we have of Christ’s life in his life. thank you for that thought you shared.

    Mart, thank you again for your brilliant work and thoughts. this must be a sacrifice of your time. thank you so much. this is the best site! if it weren’t for you, we would miss so much. may the Lord bless you and your family. hope you have a lovely, restful weekend.

  40. xrgarza says:

    Bubbles,

    Not stupid at all, as a matter of fact quite insightful. See when I don’t understand a spiritual principle I bring it to the natural and vise-a-versa. I figure I know a little bit about each dimension. When Jesus walked the earth He spoke in parables He brought the message down to their world in a way that would make it so easy for them to understand.

    That is what God does today, the Bible says that He is the same yesterday, today, and forever He will teach us through our pets, like with Balaam his donkey or any way He can.

    PS: You know about my truck? I feel like I’m with family here you folks really care definitely keep me in prayer while I’m on the road. God has given me a lot of mercy while on the road, you see I don’t tell many people this (as I’m whispering) You see I haven’t always been a class A driver no as a matter of fact I used to be a class C drive too not long ago. (Just a little humor)

    Bubbles have a great weekend,

    Since I live here in Sacramento I am taking my son and his family to the California State fair this weekend.

    PS: let me know how the spell check tip works for you

    Blessing to all
    Xavier

  41. HEY REV says:

    GOT HERE LATE AND NOT MUCH TO ADD. NOBODY LEFT MUCH FOR ME TO WRITE ABOUT. A LITTLE FROM THIS ONE AND A LITLE FROM THAT ONE,THAN IT WOULD HAVE BEEN JUST A REPEAT. THANKS EVERYONE.

    MART, DON’T KNOW YOUR HIGHEST COMMENT INPUT BUT THIS LOOKS LIKE IT WOULD ADD TO THE OTHERS.
    THANK YOU FATHER GOD FOR ALL YOU DID FOR US, TO US AND IN US THAT OUR HEARTS GIVE YOU ALL PRAISE, GLORY, AND HONOR IN JESUS NAME. AMEN AND AMEN

  42. Loretta Beavis says:

    The width and the depth of these postings kept me thinking all the days, and Psalm 139 (NKJ), (esp. verse 14) kept ringing in my heart, that we are ” … fearfully and wonderfully made … .”

    God searches us and knows us, acquainted with all my ways. Like a parent knowing who was in the cookie jar, without asking, I can’t hide my heart from God. And I suppose that’s what the fear-fullness is, created in me, that keeps me in awe of Him.

    Verse 17: “How precious also are thy thoughts unto me, O God, how great is the sum of them!”

    I love my Jesus

  43. Helmet says:

    Hi again everybody.
    Let me see if I got the point. As I read I was remembering obout a bible study, something entitled like fault complex, when a believer commit a sin, and then thinks that it is too bad for being forgiven, or ‘has no face’ to talk with God, then, he gets in a bad circle: far from God, then sin, so in sin feels guilty and comes it again and again, in a sutuation called in spanish ‘extrañamiento’ (I didn’t get the translation, there’s no one) like being far from home, with no belonging to God feeling. It is the same in believers than no believers, but, both has rescue trusting in God, for first or again.

    I think, guilty feeling could be a blessing, without it, no one of us could kneeled. It were my broken heart, and my guilt that made me turn my face to God when He were looking for me (btw no one look for God), and give up my proud and kneeled. Pain would end, when we trust Jesus has paid the complete price. And so, that He would work in my heart to really forgive those I can’t.

    Stockholm Syndrome, I understand is like a mechanism of defense, like if you can’t with your enemy, join him.

    Kiss for all, SPECIALLY 4 POOH

  44. poohpity says:

    I know this is off topic but lately I have been breaking all the rules :-( I went to Carrabba’s after church today and had the most delicious thing called Pasta Wezzie. They set me buy two other tables both had a mother and daughter combo and I just wept missing the times mom and I went to lunch after church. Boy I miss her!! I am getting pretty lonely but I know this to shall pass.

  45. poohpity says:

    LOL I meant by not buy. Gee!! Whatever my mind is off track today. lol

  46. poohpity says:

    Hey there girl how is it below the border? Sure have missed you what’s up?

  47. foreverblessed says:

    Xrgarza, thanks for your comment:
    -See when I don’t understand a spiritual principle I bring it to the natural and vise-a-versa. –

    So this is what I thought:
    Think of a man who is engaged to a woman. He really loves her, but then finds out that she is in fear of not loving him enough, in fear of hurting him.
    Do you think he wants her to marry hin like that?
    No, he will spend much more time with her, so she will relax being with him, not walking on her toes all the time. He will show how much he loves her.
    His banner over me is love Song of Solomon 2:4
    He sais to her: Arise, come, my darling my beautiful one, come with me.

    Christ as the bridegroom, and the Church as the Bride.

    Yes I think you are right about Paul, he was busy most of the time, explaining that the OT must be seen in the light of the new Life we now can have in Jesus. And that that’s what the law was looking forward to.
    The law leads us to the knowledge of sin, once we know what sin is, we do not have to look for guidance to the law, that’s not why it was made for.
    And I get the idea I am busy right now, explaining that again:

    DMG, I am realy suprised by your answer, and when you would have looked at my last post carefully, how can you say that hanging on to Jesus is faith without fruit? I was describing how God filles you with His love when you hold on to Him, when you are praying for each other. Did that sound like a fruitless life?

    God will give the fruit. Like the branches of a grapevine, when it holds on the the trunk the fluids will flow through it, And the flowing will result in fruit.
    The effort is afcourse in holding unto the trunk.
    And yes , we have to say NO to sin, but do we do that out of fear?
    Maybe we will start of with Jesus because of fear.
    But when we feel the gentle lead of Jesus, His immensly great love, we do not have to fear.

    Fear has to do with punishment.

    We no longer have to be afraid for punishment, because we are forgiven, And we know what sin is, we do want to stay away from that, because we have gone over to the kingdom of light. The kingdom of darkness we have left, we do not want to go back to it.
    We know we should not lie, steal, covet, kill, be sexually immoral. Be drunkards. (If you cannot stop these things you might need deliverance, or you have not resisted it to point of blood Hebrews 12:4)

    But we are now doing business with Life. And our cup which was empty, is now being filled. After the discussion of the cup half full, I begin to realise, that it is the goal of our life with Christ, that our cup is getting fuller and fuller. Over the top, filled with life. Focus on what is lasting, go on to the real thing: compassion, love, modesty, gentleness, endurance, perseverence,
    And we know that these things we do not have of ourselves, we have to hang on to the tree in order to be filled like that.
    That’s why Paul almost begs his readers:
    When you live in the Sprit, you will have fullfilled the law, then he names all the fruit, and then he asks, against such things there is no law.
    Live by the Spirit, and you will not satisfy the desires of the sinful nature.
    Galatians 5.

    1 Jof 4:18 There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.

    So we see here, that Jesus is perfecting His love in us, like a Bridegroom preparing His Bride.

    But maybe you want to say that your fear is like deep respect, and reverence, then we talk about the same thing.

    Let me add one more thing. When the gospel is first preached in an area where there was widespread immorality, then the teaching of the new life in Christ must be very direct and strict. No more sexual sins, no more alcoholism, no more you name what sort of practices, whitchgcraft
    When the monks from Ireland and England invaded the continent of Europe in the dark ages, when the continent was recovering from the devastation of the huns and the catholic church was very weak, they started monastries with very strict rules. Maybe that was the best thing to do.
    But these strict rules are meant as a start. To break with the old habits of a sinfull life. Nobody knows they have to stay true to one peson in marriage, do not have to get drunk every night, do not have to ask the spiritual world for guidance, like following druids, whitches. Pacifying all these gods with sacrifices.
    But the strict rules are of no use for the real life God wants us to have in Christ. And that is what Paul is trying to tell us, and what Maarten Luther found out.

  48. francis somerwell says:

    Dear Mart,
    thanks for this article, recently i had to encounter with people who take the generational curses more serious and undermine the ‘Power of Cross’ and ‘Grace of Christ’. this clearly supported my thought and i passed this message to them.

  49. xrgarza says:

    foreverblessed,

    Yes I could not agree with you more. I have this theory that the Lord often refers to us as His bride and he has gone to prepare a place for His bride, He is returning one day for a bride without spot or wrinkle.

    My question shouldn’t this be my example as well? The church is also described as sheep, so for one we are not very smart like the sheep and two our number one priority is our security like that of a woman.

    So as a man before I think of marrying a lady I should have a placed prepared to bring her to, not a place that is going to require her income to be able to stay there, if so then I am using her. I am not saying that she should not contribute, but it should not be her primary responsibility.

    The Bible says if I owe anyone anything I am a slave to them, If I owe on a house so much that I need my wife’s income to pay for it am I not subjecting her to this bondage?

    I know that many will disagree with me, but I am not here to force my values or principles to anyone but if I could influence someone along the way, Praise God!

    Xavier

  50. poohpity says:

    As a woman my security would be in the fact that I would feel protected and honored by my husband. Security also in the fact that He puts God above me in everything. It would have no security for me in knowing that we rented or even owned a home. A tent would be nice but not mandatory that was a little humor. :-) As far as having a place prepared for us by the Lord that is something that is all together different since the bride is both male/female folks. Someone who loved you would be willing to live in the back of your truck if it meant being close to you now that is security. Knowing that someone would never leave you for no reason whatsoever, talk about security.

    If that is how you feel Xavier and what you hold to as security that is OK but I believe a lot of women would feel different.

  51. xrgarza says:

    Deborah,

    I agree with you to a sense and the only reason women would feel different is because our society has changed so much since the scriptures have been written they haven’t always been this way.

    I may sound a little extreme, but I have the time to be, I am in no rush and there is no lady in my life currently so do I shoot for a personal goal and if I meet a lady, and we marry hopefully we could live in a home that would not require her income and be able to live within our means that paycheck to paycheck stuff is for the birds.

    If I fail to plan I should plan to fail. I don’t like failing just for the sake of failing. I want to be prepared as much as possible. And if the Bible is a book of principles and if I can in fact apply them to my life on a day-to-day basis, why not?

    Deborah, you don’t have to agree with me or any other woman for that matter,….. But I know I’m right :)

    Xavier

  52. poohpity says:

    It is not extreme, it is you and that is OK. I think you are gallant in your beliefs.

    My point being that material things do not bring security to any human being in Christ unless their focus is truly not in Christ. Our security is in Christ alone. I maybe from another world but that is what I believe.

  53. bravjim says:

    This is something that I used to struggle with myself. It is a matter of not understanding or knowing who God is; the lovingkindness He showed to us through the cross. Learning about Luther’s struggle, and his breakthrough helped lead me to a point where I grew to understand for the first time the true meaning of God’s love and grace. That He is able to forgive me not because of anything that I’ve done, but through what He did on the cross and having faith in that work alone as the sole source of my salvation. It is His grace, which is a work of love, that freed me from my prison of a cycle of despair.

    Understanding the words “The just shall live by faith”; coming to realize that it was important enough that God used that phrase 3 seperate times in 3 seperate sections of the bible in order to get it into our heads drove home the fact for me how important it is that we not try to justify ourselves; it only leads us into a prison of despair and sadness. We received His Spirit so that we could experience His joy. It does not make sense that we should squander the joy that He has given us by falling into such a cycle. After all, he died to set us free from our bonds, not to bind us in despair.

  54. foreverblessed says:

    I say a big YES to the above post: the just shall live by faith.
    The other verse which was metioned here:
    Faith without works is dead
    It haunted me in my younger years at church, to afraid of living in faith, there might not be works.

    After thinking it over and praying about it last weekend, this thaught came in my mind:

    When there are no works: the faith is dead!

    Look at your faith, why is it not alive?
    Do not start to work, because if your faith is alive, you will do works, because God will show you things to do. The Holy Spirit will do that.

    It’s like a horse and carriage: do not put the horse behind the carriage. (that’s a saying in dutch)

  55. foreverblessed says:

    Just to join in the discussion of owning a house on the basis of one salary. I am very thankfull that we could buy a house on one salary, I did not have to work in order to pay the mortgage. Before we could buy a house we rented one, when we first got married, it happened to be a very cheap rent. But slowly the rent would go up and up.
    If you can plan wisely, it is better to do so.
    I was happy not to have to work, and stay home with the kids. Besides, the work load of my husband was sometimes enormous, and he didn’t come home till very late. It would have been very hard for me to take care of the kids, and have a job. It is very hard work for working mothers. It should be avoided if possible.
    That’s also a cycle which can become a cycle of despair, the mortgage which is too high.

    Years ago I saw it as sin when mothers would go to work, just for the sake of having a career. That is like judging other people, and is not good.
    Now I think it is better for the mother to stay at home if she can, the kids need someone around them.

    My youngest son left home a few weeks ago, for his studies at university. It feels a bit empty, what is my job now?
    (That’s maybe why I started to post on this blog.)

    But I do not want to come in a cycle of despair again, pray this over with God, He will give an answer. And in the meantime I think it is good to be a housewife and enjoy it too. Enjoying sweeping the dust, can you imagine? I found out that is is possible, if you start the day with Jesus, and remeber who you are in Him.

  56. pegramsdell says:

    Maybe you can volunteer at a school or hospital. You can have a ministry there. Just a suggestion. :)

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