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The H Word

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History can seem like a bad word.

What else can so quickly deflate the ego of a scientist who has to accept how many scientific findings have later been disproven; the Bible scholar who has to face how many possibilities, have been suggested over the years for meanings of biblical words and statements; or the follower of Jesus who  discovers that the reputation of Christians is the excuse most people use for not accepting Christ?

Yet, the very history that so quickly humbles us is what makes the record of the Bible so good for us.

The Book that gives us the history our failures is the book that, looking back, shows how our God uses our weakness to show his strength; our sins to bring us to his mercy; and our inability to explain the fairness of life to remind us that the H word that brings us to the injustice of the crucifixion of Christ is not a bad word.

In words of surprising celebration, a messenger of the Cross sums up the tragic history of human failure with a rescue that, looking back, is merciful beyond description (Rom 3:22-28); and, looking forward, is reason to think that the undisclosed judgments and plans of God will be far worse than we feared– but eventually far better than we could ever have ever hoped or thought (Rom 11:33-36).


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109 Responses to “The H Word”

  1. confeticat says:

    The highs and the lows. The Rom. 11:33-36 passage is perhaps the best Paul ever wrote. The other, Rom. 3:22-28, is a hack job.

    In it he lists ways we can be right with God. Virtually everyone qualifies. He has God almost desperately giving away the store.
    v. 22 by placing our faith in Jesus Christ
    faith rises and falls, it is as fickle as we are
    it is an important beginning, until we know Jesus
    v. 24 a gift. God just says, here you miserable
    sinner, I’m declaring you righteous
    v. 25 when you believe. A high percentage of the
    people in this country believe that Jesus
    died on the cross and shed his blood
    v. 26 to demonstrate his righteousness
    God is putting on a show and opening heaven’s
    doors to sinners
    v. 27 not by works. God grades on the curve.
    live as you please, you’re still right with God
    v.28 not by obeying the law
    if you don’t obey the law, then who are you
    going to obey?

  2. Bill says:

    Gee whiz, Mart. I thought your post today could not possibly elicit controversy or contention.

    confeticat proved me wrong.

    I don’t think I’ve ever encountered someone who described Paul’s writings as “a hack job,” or who complains that God is “giving away the store” instead of rejoicing that sinners are loved into heaven.

    God bless you, confeticat! You put a smile on my face. Again.

  3. confeticat says:

    And what would heaven be like, Bill, with people there as they are here? The mess the Church is in is caused by people who think they have been declared righteous.

  4. remarutho says:

    Good Morning Mart & Friends –

    Mart, you wrote:

    “The Book that gives us the history our failures is the book that, looking back, shows how our God uses our weakness to show his strength; our sins to bring us to his mercy; and our inability to explain the fairness of life to remind us that the H word that brings us to the injustice of the crucifixion of Christ is not a bad word.”

    Human inability to grasp or “explain the fairness of life” is the hallmark of the human race! One term for God bringing justice out of injustice is “scandal.” The hatred with which Israel hated Messiah was appalling – destructive – scandalous – an all-time low point in the judicial systems of both God’s people and their pagan conquerors. Yet, Jesus said, “Father, forgive them; for they do not know what they are doing.” (Luke 23:34)

    For any and all who believe in him, the very miracle of his resurrection is freely given as a gift. How wonderful is his grace to even me! History shows the cleansing power of Jesus’ blood.

    Blessings,
    Maru

  5. Bill says:

    @Maru, what a wonderful post! Thank you for sharing. “Scandal,” indeed. I think we’ll all be incredibly surprise by who is in heaven…and who is not.

    @confeticat, you wrote: “And what would heaven be like, Bill, with people there as they are here?”

    I can’t answer that other than to say heaven will be unlike anything we’ve ever known, yet as familiar as a family reunion. Frankly, I am not worried about what people will be like once they get there. How we’ll all change, or what we’ll change into to enable all of us to get along, is not a question we can answer here. But I’m pretty sure God won’t let a bunch of bozos into heaven who will cause dissension, anger, hate, violence, and wage self-centered power plays. He’s been preparing for this since before the beginning of time. Why do you have so little faith that He knows what He’s doing?

    You really don’t like Paul, do you? Are there other authors of books of the Bible with whom you disagree so vehemently?

  6. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    Not sure what you are getting at Mart or what response you want from us.
    Living in a place where you trip over History & the H word every day it seems totally natural to be reminded of past successes & failures at every turn.
    The Bible reminds us of where we were and who we were and what we have become through disobedience.
    It is also a complete account of God’s plan to restore us back to our original state with Him.
    Only now we no longer have to live in a garden but are seated in heavenly places with Christ and are sons and heirs with Him.
    Just because the H word surrounds us does not mean we have to be stuck in the past.
    Less than 20 years ago Team GB got just one Gold Medal in the Olympics, last week we got 29. History teaches us not to make the same mistakes, to move on and change the way we approach life and improve our performance.
    Paul taught us to fine tune our thinking and to cast off anything that would hinder us.

    Bob

  7. confeticat says:

    Bill, if we’re not born again, WE are the bozos.

    I have complete faith that God knows what he is doing. It’s Paul and only Paul that is the problem.

    H is for hack job.

  8. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    Mart,
    Your picture shows grave stones.
    History is not dead, it is a living thing because it lives in us and makes us who we are!

    Why look for the living among the dead?

    Response from Mart added at 1:39PM: OK, Bob, I agree. I don’t like the picture either so I am changing it, and adding this note :-). Thanks bro.

  9. confeticat says:

    Bob,saying “the Bible” tells us anything is like taking a whole meal – appetizer, salad, entre, beverage, dessert – and stirring it all togerther in one pot and serving it.

  10. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    We call that a Mc Donalds Happy Meal.

    What do you call it?

  11. remarutho says:

    Good Morning Mart & Friends —

    The scandal of the cross (thanks Bill) is chiefly, in my humble opinion, the overwhelming love and grace of the One God removing the curse once for all the ground that has been damned (the graveyards everywhere).

    Christ’s love is so great, so far beyond my heart and mind’s comprehension, that I am in danger of looking at it and still not seeing it. There is no retribution in it. All fallenness is consumed in the resurrection.

    Lord help me to celebrate you and the Life you give!
    Maru

    Note from Mart added at 1:41. Maru, you picked up on my reason for originally using a Mount of Olives grave yard. But since the image was pretty negative, am changing the picture to a “look backward” that is more positive.

  12. bratimus says:

    confeticat, the way you go after the letters of Paul, it is like a glimpse of Paul when he was Saul going after Christian.

  13. confeticat says:

    Bob, you’re funny. I’d call it a Bible Belt special by Paula Deen.

  14. confeticat says:

    Brat – But I haven’t killed any Christians – yet.

  15. Bill says:

    @confeticat, you wrote (at 7:50 am): “Bill, if we’re not born again, WE are the bozos.”

    I just realized something.

    Are you saying you’re born again (as you define it)?

    Does that mean you’ll be in heaven?

    If so, does that mean you’ll be as argumentative, cynical, judgmental, and disrespectful — especially of Paul and his letters — as you are now? For all eternity?

    Hmmm. Maybe I’m on the wrong train. :)

  16. confeticat says:

    No, because Paul’s letters won’t be in heaven.

  17. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    Heaven & Earth shall pass away but His word will last forever.
    That includes Paul’s tiny contribution!

  18. confeticat says:

    “Forever, O Lord, your word is settled in heaven.” (Psalm 119:89)

  19. SFDBWV says:

    I am supposing this subject is a carry over from our last; in that man is justified by his faith rather than by his deeds.

    Justified to whom?

    Is it saying that ones actions are justified because of their faith? Or is this saying because of their faith their actions are covered by the righteousness of God? Noting that all fall short of being able to achieve God’s righteousness, and so these actions are covered by faith that they are covered?

    So that in my own eyes my actions are justified.

    I want to clearly express there is a difference between salvation and justification.

    1 Peter 1: 12, 13, 14, 15, 16 clearly states that now that we have received the Word how we should now conduct ourselves.
    1 Peter 2: 1 tells us what to lay aside and quit doing.
    1Peter 2: 9 tells us who we now are.
    1 Peter 2: 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17 provides guidance in how we now are to *act*.

    Not an accident that my old fashioned King James Holy Bible states at the top of the pages regarding 1 Peter (Christian behavior).

    I would suggest to all that they read on all of what Peter has to say to each and every one of us.

    More later as I am out of time for now.

    Steve

  20. remarutho says:

    Good Morning All –

    The hymn to God in Romans 11 describes the massive paradigm shift that sweeps away the effects of culture upon our thinking (if we do not cling tightly to it):

    “How unsearchable are God’s judgments and unfathomable God’s ways! For who has known the mind of the Lord, or who became his counselor? Or who has first given to God that it might be paid back to him again? For from God and through God and to God are all things. To God be the glory forever. Amen.” (Romans 11:33-36)

    It seems to me that Paul is describing (with Isaiah’s help Isaiah 40:13, 14) judgment and thereby justification that is entirely out of human hands. We do not mediate the working of God’s will. It is God who has chosen to redeem his children. We can reject it, as Israel did again and again – but we cannot change it in any degree. We can accept it and “go with God,” which God intends that we do with joy. I agree, Steve, that such a surrender brings about the personal conduct Peter describes in the first letter. 1 Peter 2:17 seems especially poignant this morning, it seems to me. :o)

    Blessings,
    Maru

  21. confeticat says:

    Justification is Paul’s term, he owns it. It has been shortened to “Just as if I never sinned.” Jesus never used it.

    Steve asked, “justified by whom?” That might seem like an unnecessary question to ask – why God, of course. But Paul justified himself (I Cor. 4:3,4) and apparently was teaching other leaders to follow his example.

    A lot of us had faith that we were covered by our faith, that our faith makes us righteous in God’s sight, but that didn’t make it true. You can have faith that a chair will hold you up, but if you didn’t notice the broken leg… The one true verse Paul had in the Romans passage, Rom. 3:23, disproves the rest of what he said. According to Jesus, he fell short. All still fall short.

    To Peter’s passages we should add James 2:14,15,16,17,18. Faith without works is dead.

    But when all is said and done, neither faith nor works will meet the righteous requirements of a holy God to go to heaven. You must be born again (John 3:3).

  22. Mart De Haan says:

    confeticat, check out what Jesus said about the man who cried out for the mercy of God (Luke 18:14)

  23. Mart De Haan says:

    A comparison of the Gospel of Jesus and the Gospel of Paul has been considered at great length recently in the writings of Anglican theologian NT Wright.

    Together with many others today, Wright teaches that the Gospel of Jesus includes Paul’s Gospel of justification by faith– while embracing a good news that is as expansive and comprehensive as the new creation that goes beyond the “second/new birth” to the re-creation of heaven and earth as well.

  24. confeticat says:

    Okay, you got me there, Mart. But I meant Jesus did not use it as a doctrine. The tax collector didn’t get in the Kingdom just because he was humble.

    The book you mention sounds way over my head and therefore not very useful to the common man. I will try to check it out.

  25. poohpity says:

    How are you born again, con?

  26. confeticat says:

    John 3:1-2,3-4,5-6,7-8

  27. confeticat says:

    I’ve come up with a clue, Mart. I found out that NT Wright and John Piper are having a big debate over justification. This tells me they are probably both wrong.

  28. poohpity says:

    You gave verse about what it means but how do you do it, “being born” again I mean??

  29. poohpity says:

    con, do you not have the answer on how you do it? You seem so quick to answer everything else where is your answer now? Do you have to look it up?

  30. confeticat says:

    “You” don’t do it – God does it. It involves a lot of things – everything, really. It’s falling in love with Jesus. You come to Jesus as a child (Luke 18:17), willing to give up everything to follow him and to let go of your old life to have a completely new life (Luke 18:29). It means you give up your ‘right’ to your family, your money, everything. It’s not something that happens instantly or overnight. He sees your heart and will probably test you so that you fully understand that this is an irrevocable choice you are making. You will have many smaller tests and choices along the way, all part of pushing through that narrow door.

    That’s not the whole thing and I’m sure it’s not exactly the same for everybody, but just a capsule.

  31. phpatato says:

    I do not have time today to read this new topic. I just stopped here to tell Confeticat that I have responded to him in the last topic. I was trying to get caught up on that one and came across his response to me.

    Confeticat should you be interested, I have commented to you in the last topic.

  32. poohpity says:

    confeticat God will not allow His Spirit to come and live in a sinful vessel only in a Holy one. So how do you become able to be born of the Spirit, “born again”? I will again offer you the only way to receive that Spirit if you will acknowledge what Jesus did on the Cross for your sins? He was lifted up on a pole in your place so that anyone who believes in that act will become sons of God and the Holy Spirit will seal them and they will be born again. It can happen in a second once you accept the atoning work of the Cross and in that that Jesus is in fact the Messiah/Christ. Do you believe that Jesus died in your place on the Cross?

  33. confeticat says:

    Your first sentence is exactly the reason we need to be born again. We were born in sin, and we sinned more. The person that we were born as cannot be holy. Of course I believe Jesus died on the cross for my sins and that he is the Messiah. I don’t know how long the actual birth takes, God doesn’t tell us when that happens, but you are deluding yourself if you think you can just walk down an aisle, or say a few words, or shed a few tears, and be born again.

  34. Mart De Haan says:

    confeticat,
    What about the thief on the cross whose expression of trust in Jesus was expressed with the words, “Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom.” And Jesus said, “Today you will be with me in paradise.” (Luke 23:42-43).

    My intent is not just to proof text but to consider these words in light of the story behind them.

  35. confeticat says:

    There are certain things about that I don’t understand, but there is no doubt he was saved, probably as an OT believer, because Jesus said he would be with him in paradise. Is that what you think?

  36. confeticat says:

    OT believers will be in the Kingdom of God (Luke 13:28) I’m just not sure how they get there!

  37. poohpity says:

    confeticat that is exactly what I believe. Just the very second I believed I was born again. Just a Jesus told Nicodemus in the rest of John 3:12,13,14,15,16,17 as the conversation gets finished.

  38. poohpity says:

    If it is as you say then it is dependent on something I can do to earn it being born again is a gift from God and does not mean I have to give up my family, my money, my life. It means Jesus gave up His life and the results of me believing in Him is what changes how I view my family, my money and my life now with a heart, mind and soul depending on heavenly things where before it has to do with earthly matters but since I am born of the Spirit that is who holds my life in His hands.

  39. SFDBWV says:

    Mart, history is by no way a bad word for me. Even if I consider my own personal history of foolish behavior of my youth.

    It is from history that we can apply wisdom and learn from our mistakes and not repeat them.

    Sigmund Freud stated, in his world view of the mind and what us tick, that we are forever doomed to repeat our mistakes over and over again until we die.

    The history of NT Scripture is that we can break that mold only by being born again with a new spirit and new desires.

    That same Scripture gives us directions as to how and be *born again*. Not wishing to trivialize the process and also not wanting to write a book and spend a couple hours quoting Scripture, let me simplify by saying the process begins with accepting Jesus to be the Son of God and placing all of your faith on Him. As of that moment we are covered by the Blood of the Lamb of God and *justified* because of our faith.

    Justified in the Hebrew meaning to make righteous and in the Greek to render as innocent or righteous.

    “However other men cannot see our faith and therefore we must be justified in the sight of men by our works. True saving faith inevitably will manifest itself in works of righteousness.” (Ephesians 2: 8, 9, 10)

    I put the above statement in quotations because I copied it from another source. It agreed with my thoughts so I *borrowed* it.

    Steve

  40. dagny says:

    What is an “OT believer”?

  41. poohpity says:

    I need to make a clarification on I believe exactly that the minute I walk down an isle or confess with tears that I have sinned and accept what Jesus did I am “born again” That very moment. I have to do nothing because Jesus did it all.

  42. poohpity says:

    An OT believers like Abraham believed in the promise that one day there would come someone who was sent by God to take away the sins of the world just as God provided the ram for Abraham’s sacrifice rather than his son.

  43. confeticat says:

    It’s one thing to say a bunch of flowery words about Jesus and another to give up your life for him. He said “If you love me, you will keep my commandments.” (John 14:15). It’s a matter of how much you love him that will determine how much you want to follow and obey him. If you’re just trying to get by with the minimum, you’ll never know him and the peace and satisfaction he gives.

    You’re not earning it, you’re pleasing the one you love. If you love someone, you want to be with them, not just talk about them. It isn’t easy, but after you’ve done it you wouldn’t trade being in him for anything. (John 10:10)

    The idea of any birth taking place in a second with no effort is unrealistic and the only place I’ve heard of it is in church! (John 16:21)

  44. poohpity says:

    I do not feel we need to justify our faith by works. God knows what we believe. Reread those Eph verses. We live out our faith by showing grace to others just like we have been shown. If we believe it is shown by a humble dependence on the Lord and sure it comes out in what we do but the minute we boost in our works that shows the exact opposite of what we say we believe.

  45. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    Job said “I know that my redeemer lives”

    In that statement he professed the birth, death and Resurrection of The Messiah.

    That is an OT believer.

    David’s Psalms also professed the same.

    Abraham was given a promise that one day one day through his line would come a saviour who would bless all mankind.
    And so it goes on.

    Bob

  46. poohpity says:

    It is not a human birth which because of the fall comes with much pain but it is a spiritual birth and it was with much pain, the horrible pain Jesus suffered on the Cross. I do not have to please Jesus because He is already pleased with me because I believe in Him. I can not earn that love it was freely given just as any love is.

  47. confeticat says:

    Traffic jam – OT means Old Testament – I’m sorry. Pooh, your 2:05 comment is through the blood. We cannot attain the Kingdom through the blood. That’s why it has to be separate from salvation.

  48. poohpity says:

    Yes we can, it is not separate from salvation it is one in the same. Jesus loved us while we were yet sinners he died on the Cross for our sins. Even before we knew Him but He knew us.

  49. confeticat says:

    You don’t HAVE to please Jesus, but why would you not want to? Earning means you are working to be paid. Jesus wants what you do for him to be out of love.

  50. confeticat says:

    THE LIE THAT WENT AROUND THE WORLD

    In that place between wakefulness and dreams, I found myself in the room. There were no distinguishing features except for the one wall covered with small index card files. They were like the ones in libraries that list titles by author or subject in alphabetical order. But these files, which stretched from floor to ceiling and seemingly endless in either direction, had very different headings.

    As I drew near the wall of files, the first to catch my attention was one that read “Girls I Have Liked”. I opened it and began flipping through the cards. I quickly shut it, shocked to realize that I recognized the names written on each one.

    And then without being told, I knew exactly where I was. This lifeless room with its small files was a crude catalog system for my life. Here were written the actions of my every moment, big and small, in a detail my memory couldn’t match. A sense of wonder and curiosity, coupled with horror, stirred within me as I began randomly opening files and exploring their content. Some brought joy and sweet memories; others a sense of shame and regret so intense that I would look over my shoulder to see if anyone was watching.

    A file named “Friends” was next to one marked “Friends I Have Betrayed”. The titles ranged from the mundane to the outright weird. “Books I Have Read”, “Lies I have Told”, “Comfort I Have Given”, “Jokes I Have Laughed At.” Some were almost hilarious in their exactness: “Things I’ve Yelled at My Brothers.” Others I couldn’t laugh at: “Things I have Done in My Anger.” “Things I Have Muttered Under My Breath at My Parents.” I never ceased to be surprised by the contents. Often there were many more cards than I expected. Sometimes fewer than I hoped. I was overwhelmed by the sheer volume of the life I had lived. Each was written in my own handwriting, each signed with my signature.

    When I pulled out the file marked “TV shows I Have Watched”, I realized the files grew to contain their contents…the cards were packed tightly, and yet after two or three yards, I hadn’t found the end of the file. I shut it, shamed by the vast time I knew that file represented. When I came to a file marked “Lustful Thoughts,” I felt a chill run through my body. I pulled the file out only an inch, not willing to test its size, and drew out a card. I shuddered at its detailed content. I felt sick to think that such a moment had been recorded.

    An almost animal rage broke on me. One thought dominated my mind: No one must ever see these cards, this room! I have to destroy them! And then the tears came. I began to weep. Sobs so deep that they hurt. They started in my stomach and shook through me. I fell on my knees and cried. I cried from the overwhelming shame of it all. The rows of file shelves swirled in my tear-filled eyes. No one must ever know of this room. I must lock it up and hide the key. But then as I pushed away the tears, I saw Him. No, please not Him. Not here. Oh, anyone but Jesus.

    I watched helplessly as he began to open the files and read the cards. I couldn’t bear to watch his response. In the moments I could bring myself to look at his face, I saw a sorrow deeper than my own. He seemed to intuitively go to the worst boxes. Why did he have to read every one?

    Finally he turned and looked at me from across the room. He looked at me with pity in his eyes, a pity that didn’t anger me. I dropped my head, covered my face with my hands and began to cry again. He walked over and put his arm around me. He could have said so many things. But he didn’t say a word. He just cried with me.

    Then he got up and walked back to the wall of files. Starting at one end of the room, He took out a file and, one by one, began to sign his name over mine on each card. “No!” I shouted rushing to him. His name shouldn’t be on these cards. But there it was, written in red so rich, so dark, and so alive. The name of Jesus covered mine. It was written with his blood. He gently took the card back, smiled a sad smile and began to sign the cards.

    I heard him close the last file and walk back to my side. He placed his hand on my shoulder and said, “It is finished.” I stood up, and he led me out of the room. There was no lock on its door. There were still cards to be written. “For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.” John 3:16

  51. Bill says:

    @confeticat, your latest post is from something called “The Room,” by Brian Keith Moore.

    I do wish you’d attribute your posts so that we can discern between what you write and what can be found online.

    It also published online as “The Room,” by Joshua Harris.

    It seems that’s been making the rounds for a long time, attributed to a variety of authors.

  52. confeticat says:

    I changed a little bit of it, and deleted some for length. That’s why I didn’t mention that it was borrowed. Steve borrowed something so I thought I could too.

  53. poohpity says:

    Yes, His name is written in red over every little detail of our lives from history into the future. After all Jesus is the Christ our redeemer. Who saved us from the consequences of our sins.

    I want to please Jesus and I do when I trust and depend on Him, live in a vital union and tell others what He has done in my life and will do in theirs, show grace and mercy to those who do not deserve it just like I did not deserve it and to forgive as I have been forgiven. All of that I can not do on my own by only with the help of the One who did it all.

  54. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    Mart,

    You’ve changed the picture from grave stones to a rear view mirror.
    Now that reflects what history is:
    A reflection of what has been while we travel into the future.
    But the main reason we have rear view mirrors (history) is to make us aware of the dangers when the past overtakes the present.

    Bob

  55. confeticat says:

    Then you better get hustling toward that narrow door!

  56. poohpity says:

    Steve did not “cite” his either. :-)

  57. confeticat says:

    Objects in mirror are closer than they appear.

  58. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    Only in the USA does that warning have to be written on a rear view mirror.
    We have been overtaken so many times by past events that we know how close history can get and that it often jumps up and bites us in the bum.

  59. Bill says:

    @pooh, and confeticat, fair enough. I didn’t see Steve’s post.

    I mean no disrespect. I think it’s my journalism background that makes me a stickler for attribution.

    Carry on.

    I’ll just shut up and read what everybody else posts…

  60. confeticat says:

    Thank you for saving us, Bill. None of the rest of us wanted to jump up and bite Bob in the bum – ha.

  61. poohpity says:

    Please do not shut up, Bill you have much good to say and I have learned a lot from what you write.

  62. SFDBWV says:

    The portion of my comments in quotation that I stated were from another writing, has no author, but can be found in the “Institue for Creation Research” “Days of Praise” Daily Devotional, Tuesday, December 20, 2011.

    I only respond because I have been called here by one of you to have done something wrong. I never said that the comment was mine in fact I said it was exactly what I wanted to say, so in the interest of time I borrowed it.

    This sort of distraction from the gist of what is being given as an honest approach to present a view is most distressing, I would call it a cheap shot and nothing less. I don’t think its cute and I don’t think it apporpriate.

    Disgusted,
    Steve

  63. poohpity says:

    I do not think anyone said you did anything wrong. confeticat said because you did not cite the author of your quote so he did not either that means to me that he was looking to you as an example to follow. Neither one did anything wrong per se. So please do not be disgusted. We are all infallible. I do not think it was meant as a put down in anyway at least from me it was not. Yes I have broken the comment guidelines by speaking about what is meant by being “born Again” and I ask for the forgiveness of all. I will get back on topic. ooops, I fouled up again.

  64. poohpity says:

    I am so glad to have the history in the Bible. It showed me that God can and does use whomever He knows has a heart for Him, whether they lie and cheat (Abraham, Jacob, Zacchaeus), or a prostitute (Rehab, Mary), murderer and adulterer (David) and the list goes on of how many characters fell short of God’s highest but were used because they loved God.

  65. confeticat says:

    I thought Steve’s quote was very good and I don’t care where he got it from. Christians should get over who gets the credit. That’s not to put you down, Bill, i already told you I like your writing. I can’t imagine what guidelines Pooh could have broken either.

    That’s what i was trying to get across in that long piece. if I were a person who gets depressed that would have depressed me. That Jesus keeps files on everybody like the FBI. I know God keeps records, but not on Kingdom people,

  66. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    Well said Debbie,

    Everyone of us could be written into bible history.
    We all have stories of failure and some are greatly used by God and others just humble servants awaiting that moment, like Joseph in prison, when our God given dream will come to past.

    Bob

  67. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    That’s what makes the Bible so alive and vital for daily living today.

  68. confeticat says:

    No, if you are born again the failure was by the person you used to be. You have a clean slate. I don’t know, as I said, exactly how God works with OT people, but they would have had to come to the place of repentance, beyond that i don’t think it’s a need-to-know for us.

    The files, the catalog of sins does not exist for the person born again. The author of that had Jesus canceling them, but you notice, they still went back into the file. Not so with a born again person.

  69. confeticat says:

    And also the person had more life to live and more cards to accumulate, and all he learned from this experience was that Jesus would take care of anything he did. So he was free to live as he pleased.

  70. poohpity says:

    con, There are guidelines up on the left hand side for those who comment on here to follow to prevent harm.

    It is true that our slates are wiped clean from past but we have to keep them clean by admitting when we mess up everyday and ask for the Lord to forgive us.(1 John 1:9,10) It is an ongoing process that we must be aware of while we are harnessed to these bodies until we get to heaven and receive our new resurrected vessels. Which it is difficult to wait on but it gives me hope.

  71. poohpity says:

    The whole Bible is a need to know kinda book. ;-)

  72. confeticat says:

    I read the guidelines once but no one pays attention to them so I forgot them.

    It is not necessary to ask the Lord every day to forgive you if you have truly been born again. If you are obeying Jesus, you won’t be sinning. Nor are we receiving new resurrected vessels in heaven, but that’s another topic.

  73. kingdomkid7 says:

    Being “free to live as [you] please” is a good thing, confeticat, because (as I think you may have wisely pointed out earlier), you will WANT to please Jesus once you begin to taste, see and understand how great a salvation He has wrought for you by His perfect sacrifice. Looking at the catalog of forgiven sins is also cause for rejoicing, not depression. You don’t dwell on the past (“forgetting those things behind”), but you always rejoice in the wonderful gift you’ve received.

  74. confeticat says:

    Yes, you will want to please Jesus and thank him for his great salvation, but we shouldn’t get stuck there. There’s more beyond salvation. The world is free to live as they please. A child of God is not, nor will he want to.

    The catalog of forgiven sins was not a cause for rejoicing for the boy in the story. He was ashamed and remorseful. Christians take their sin too lightly. They should be depressed by it, then hopefully they will do something about it.

  75. poohpity says:

    Well confeticat, I will not be calling God a liar at this point or ever. Do you lie? Do you steal? Do you get angry? Do you hate? If it is yes then there is still sin and we need to ask God and the person we have offended to forgive us. God says we will still sin but when we admit to it we will be forgiven. 1 John 1:9,10. I know you do not care for much of what the Bible says but I do.

    Just like you said that others do not follow the guidelines the Lord teaches me to respect and think of others as better than myself and since this is Mart’s blog and he has requested we follow them I will and when I mess up I will ask for forgiveness and get back on track. It is a sin against God and Mart. Mart did give us some leeway and that was to share how the weather is in our neck of the woods and just because others do not follow them it is not all right for me to be like them nor is it OK for me, as I did in the past, to call them on it. Until Mart takes them down I will try and honor them.

  76. confeticat says:

    You realize don’t you, Pooh, that being legalistic and saying you sin all the time don’t go together. It’s kinda like oil and water – they don’t mix.

  77. confeticat says:

    Good night.

  78. remarutho says:

    Good Evening Mart & Friends —

    I agree, Mart, that the rear-view mirror is less stark than the graves of Olivet. Still, if we had been able to stay on topic here, I believe we could have explored the One who is not only the Ground of Being — but also Him in whose hand reality remains. No small subject, how ever it is illustrated.

    In the history of God’s relationship with his people dwells the truth of God’s ways. Systematic study does not yield a theology for living. It is a strange and wondrous thing. Hard to discuss. Not a particularly fruitful day’s discussion, in my view. Nobody is perfect…Lord willing, we will do better tomorrow.

    Blessings,
    Maru

  79. confeticat says:

    The discussion of this blog is about ‘looking back’. We can gain many insights from looking back at history. But when it comes to the Kingdom of God, Jesus said “Anyone who puts a hand to the plow and then looks back is not fit for the Kingdom of God.” (Luke 9:62).

    Now I’ve heard that explained as “keeps looking back”, or “looking back longingly”, as Lot’s wife did when she had to leave Sodom. Maybe this would include continuing to look in our rear view mirror, or reviewing over in our minds what happened yesterday. As for history, there is no precedent for the Kingdom of God.

  80. bratimus says:

    being legalistic and saying you sin isn’t wrong. Remember that the law points out our sins. The law points out guilt and punishment. Christ gives us forgiveness and salvation and that is how the law is fulfilled and completed. this is gone over in the letters of Paul when read and under stood

  81. remarutho says:

    Good Morning Mart & Friends –

    Mart, you wrote:
    “Yet, the very history that so quickly humbles us is what makes the record of the Bible so good for us.”

    You mentioned the scientist whose theories do not hold up over time, as new discoveries are made; and the Bible scholar who must face a (huge) body of theological writing that contradicts itself on every side.

    It seems to me we can all only return to the Scriptures seeking the Lord, moreover seeking to know God’s ways. I have been reading Ezekiel this past few days. While it is not possible to generalize from a history set in the 6th c. BC, it is worth noting that because of Israel’s attitude (Ezekiel 12:21, 22) – the Lord gave the prophet a word for them: “The days draw near as well as the fulfillment of every vision. For there will no longer be any false vision or flattering divination within the house of Israel.” (Ezekiel 12:23, 24) In context, it was less than a year before the Babylonian army took Jerusalem down. Without dragging this passage into the 21st c. it is clear that the problem then was much like the problem now: Many speak out of their own concepts. In this they bear a burden for declaring what is false (Ezekiel 13:10) to the people.

    Paul, the messenger of the Cross you cite, was a good student of the Scriptures. He teaches that faith in Jesus produces a work that could not have been accomplished before God came in the flesh: “This was to demonstrate His righteousness, because in the forbearance of God He passed over the sins previously committed; for the demonstration, I say, of his righteousness at the present time, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus. Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a law of faith.” (Romans 3:25, 26, 27)

    There is no precedent for a law of faith. It shatters the entire cultural model of cases decided by a body of elders applying the law and meting out penalties. In our days and the days to come, there is forgiveness (being justified before the Law of God) for anyone who believes in Messiah. It is astonishing! The courtroom model of justice does not/will not hold up in the kingdom of God.

    Blessings,
    Maru

  82. remarutho says:

    To my understanding, then, the judgments of human beings amount to nothing. It is only the judgment of God that has eternal meaning (Romans 11:33, 34, 35, 36). I pray this understanding affects what I say and do! It is profoundly humbling to me.
    Maru

  83. confeticat says:

    Maru, your 9:01 post is right on. However, the law of faith is an oxymoron and it definately is not the Kingdom of God.

    Faith is not the law, it is the evidence (Heb. 11:1).

  84. remarutho says:

    Dear Confeticat —

    So happy you embrace Paul’s wonderful hymn of praise to God.

    Since you are (selectively?) anti-Paul, it seems futile to parse Romans as an answer to your statement, but here goes: “Dia noumou pisteows” — through or by a law/principle of faith. (Romans 3:27) Therefore, no boasting about keeping the law through works. God justifies by faith.

    You must now claim you are unconvinced by Paul. It could become a board-game. :o)

    Yours in Christ,
    Maru

  85. remarutho says:

    Sorry about the board-game remark. Maru

  86. confeticat says:

    I give the devil his due – every once in a while Paul came out with something pretty good. Your Greek is Greek to me (!) but that was the same verse you got it from.

    “Things not seen” in Heb. 11:1 could not include the word of God, or Scripture, or anything contained therein. The evidence has to be God speaking to us in other ways and telling us things that are not in Scripture, and elaborating on what is. Many of the “men of old” that passage goes on to speak of didn’t have the scriptures. So this ‘sola scriptura’ thing is baloney. My saying that does not detract from the Scriptures at all. Rather, it confirms the Scriptures which themselves reveal other ways God speaks to man.

  87. confeticat says:

    Maru – Better a board-game than a bored-game lol

  88. poohpity says:

    One thing I have learned about history is that it repeats itself until the lesson is learned. How many times do we repeat things only to discover been there and done that before but is my response different or am I repeating the same behavior again and again. Solomon the so called wisest person to ever live knew that his wives were leading him to worship idols but did he ever stop marrying them? No, but by the end of his life and his writings we have all his mistakes to learn by.

    We have so many failures and mistakes to learn from in the Bible but as is seen throughout the “H” word repeats itself YET our God never gives up on us. He is faithful when we are not, He shows mercy when we deserve punishment, He gives us another chance when we continually repeat history even when we have a guide book to learn from.

    con, here are a few things I have realized about you. One you say you are “born again” yet you do not know how it happens. You say after being “born again ” you never sin again yet you shared that you have stole mail and lied. You say in one breath that you believe that Jesus is the Messiah yet deny Christ which is the something. You say you think Paul is teaching something different than what Jesus taught but by your own admission you have not read the Bible. Talk about a mind that is tossed to and fro and is not sure at all of what you believe because you believe in so many things but truth. If one is unable to be honest then it is hard to recognize the truth when lies seem to consume the mind and do not seem sure about anything other than the ability to take what someone says and pick it apart to fit into raging sea of a confusion that is only fixed on causing trouble, poking fun and trying to manipulate. Gosh there must be a storm raging between those ears to desire to bring as much misery and confusion to others as is going on within.

  89. poohpity says:

    “yet deny Christ which is the something.” oops another mistake should read “yet deny Christ which is the same thing”

  90. confeticat says:

    You’re telling a pretty big whopper there yourself. Jesus is not out to make us look good to others, many of his followers may appear underhanded (Luke 6:1,2,3,4,5). But how do you think it looks for one of his followers to go on complaining that they sin every day? What you are saying is, my Lord doesn’t have my allegiance or the power to do as he said he would do. He’s a fraud, a phoney. That’s what you’re saying.

    I have read the Bible, I just don’t keep reading it straight through like a robot and count the number of times I did it. I’m sorry if I have brought misery and confusion to you, but you need SOMETHING to wake you up.

  91. poohpity says:

    The Lord is not the one who is the phony or fraud.

  92. poohpity says:

    I also believe that the Lord can heal all the confusion and misery in a person’s life as long as they seek Him not to prove others as wrong but with all their heart, soul and mind.

  93. narrowpathseeker says:

    Poohpity, your perception of Confeticat at 10:58am this morning is pretty much the same as mine. It reminded me of my dearly loved departed sister who was unbelievably oppositional. She would more often than not, disagree with me(everyone else as well)and if we agreed(with unimportant trivial matters) just to end the nonsense, she would then change horses and disagree with what she had been declaring to be right in the first place!! She needed much prayer….then again we ALL need much prayer. The day before she died she actually agreed with me on a very important matter, let go of her deep rooted anger, and made peace with God. Praise God for His Mercy and the power of prayer.

  94. remarutho says:

    Amen, Narrow! Prayer brings in God’s Mercy! Maru

  95. confeticat says:

    Bingo! So why are you, by your life, saying that he is? (Isa, 26:3; Heb. 10:26; Jude 24)

  96. poohpity says:

    So why did you being a postman steal someone’s mail knowing it was against the law thinking you knew better than a pastor that is the sin of pride? That is sinning deliberately. Isaiah 26:3 yes my mind is steadfast because I trust in the Lord not in the those who boost in a knowledge they do not possess. Jesus is the only One who can present me before the Father as blameless. Please stop throwing around things you have YET to understand but if you will stay steadfast in the Lord I know that it is only Him who will open your eyes to what those scriptures mean but as of now they seem to be a foreign language that is misunderstood and misinterpreted.

  97. poohpity says:

    As we read the Bible it is to be applied to our own lives not to apply to the lives of others. When folks take scripture out of it’s context then we are missing what the Lord is trying to teach the individual. Ask, “what is it Lord you are trying to teach me through your Word?”. Rather than reading what others write about the Bible read the Bible for yourself not just verses to prove your point but what is God’s point as applied to my life. God uses the Bible to transform our minds so that we each will be able to determine what the Will of God is and to walk in His ways no longer in our own way. That is if we want His will to be done in our lives.

  98. confeticat says:

    I’ve done things that would be worse than that in your mind, Pooh. I did them for Jesus and I’m not the least bit ashamed. One difference between you and me is, you are legalistic. As I told you, legalism does not go with self-deprecation. The fingers point back at you.

    This also takes us back to what Maru was talking about this morning – the “law of faith” (Rom. 3:27). Faith has no limits, no boundaries. Another reason it cannot be a law.

    Lest I get accused again of using Paul selectively, I use him to prove –Paul. Not to prove a truth. The fact that he mixes in truth makes him more dangerous.

  99. poohpity says:

    con, you really need some help from a mental health care provider before you hurt someone if you have not already done so.

    Mart, can you address this issue, please. I believe there needs to be an intervention, I am feeling very concerned.

  100. confeticat says:

    Where is THAT in the Bible?

  101. poohpity says:

    When we notice a person who needs help the kind thing to do is try and get them the help they need before they cause harm to themselves or others. That is seen in (Matthew 22:39 NLT). To love another is to seek out what would be in their best interest.

  102. confeticat says:

    I am not your neighbor. I wouldn’t live in Arizona with that awfyl Governor you have. Why don’t you go after HER?

  103. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    This Blog is called….
    “BEEN THINKING ABOUT by Mart DeHaan and Friends”

    Where is Mart and where are the Friends?

    So often these topics end up with just two people beating each other up.

    Time it stopped!!

    Bob

  104. confeticat says:

    A lot of help Jobette’s friends are to her! No wonder she’s such a mess! They are enablers, instead of holding her to the highest.

  105. poohpity says:

    I apologize and I will walk away because it is normally me who is in those debates and you are right it is time to stop. God bless and it has been a long trip but change is always good. See ya!!

  106. narrowpathseeker says:

    Thank you Claudia. I will be praying the SAME for ALL of us too.

  107. dust says:

    hi

    i don’t comment much but this subject spoke to me. 1 Peter 1:17 talkes about fear (KJ) and the longer i keep on this road that Jesus has gave to me the more i realise that the fear of the Lord is a good place to be in. Truely a narrow pathway.

    praise God

  108. Mart De Haan says:

    OK, I hear you. Will turn off comments on this post and try to get something else up by tomorrow morning.