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#2–Unusual Facts About the Bible

Judean Wilderness

Because the timeless, global reputation of the Bible doesn’t just rest on one unusual fact, but on many converging lines of evidence, let’s add a second to the first we’ve already begun talking about.

We began last time noting that some of the Bible’s credibility lies in the fact that it does not just tell us what we might expect to hear. For instance,

1.Both testaments describe in detail the weaknesses and failures of the people whose story they tell (i.e. leaders of Israel and the disciples of Jesus). Historians view potentially embarrassing reports of ones own group as an indicator of authenticity.

Peter’s Denial

Why would the nation of Israel, or the church of Christ retain a body of literature that catalogs their personal and collective moral, social, and spiritual failures?

By present day standards,  many would see such admissions as being unpatriotic and damaging to national interests (for Israel), and unfriendly to the collective reputation (of the church).

So here’s a second familiar fact about the Bible that remains most unusual.

2. Written by at least 40 authors over a period of 1500 years, all pens contributed to a well timed, orchestrated plotline that came together in the most unexpected of ways. Even though the hero of the Bible told both friends and enemies that Moses and the prophets were telling his story; and even though he said repeatedly that he had to suffer and die to save their lives, no one foresaw how it would all come together.

Not until a guarded tomb was found empty, and groups of disciples were reunited with their resurrected Teacher did they begin to see how he put the words and sentences of the ages in a whole new light.

Only then did they realize that what they had seen with their own eyes brought fulfillment and significance to a storyline that stretched from Moses to the present.

Today we are as they were– in the middle of the drama of the universe, knowing more than than those who went before us, but still not able to see clearly what lies ahead.

 P.S. as I hope to spend some time bringing some of these thoughts together, please help me test the merits and expand the implications to any of the above…

 


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34 Responses to “#2–Unusual Facts About the Bible”

  1. SFDBWV says:

    This is a most unexpected move, Mart, to produce a second topic along the same subject; it makes earlier comments mute to reference.

    To those of us that have come to receive the Holy Spirit, the woven fabric of Scripture makes absolute sense as we know that the author of Scripture to be God.

    The very fact that 66 books were written by 40 men over thousands of years and that they all thread together in a sequence of history and prophesy together should get the attention of any curious intellectual.

    The problem is as I have alluded to earlier that intellectuals more often than not have been poisoned by their bias educations from the world, so their search into scripture is an attempt to find fault or inconsistencies in order to validate their already established mutual thinking.

    The intellectual’s of this world and of this time consider Christianity a “myth” and with the aide of such groups as the ACLU and other organizations do all the can to present Christianity as such and *re-educate* school children to accept religion of any kind as a threat to peace and harmony among the nations of the world.

    Yet we who believe every word of Scripture to be given by God and to be understood by those whom the Holy Spirit leads into understanding know that there will never be world peace until Jesus of Nazareth sets on the seat of power in Jerusalem and governs all of mankind.

    That His very being divides people and divided people are capable of every evil known to man perpetrated against those whom they consider an enemy.

    I started to email you, Mart, a picture of Palestinians dragging a man behind a motorcycle in a parade of motorcycles cheering the torture and death of this man said to have been an Israeli spy.

    But then I know only too well both sides of war have people capable of being as heartless and cruel, so I did not.

    One of the purposes of Scripture given to us now at this time in the story of God and man is so that we can be prepared for what is coming.

    Jesus clearly said that the religious rulers of a divided Israel missed their opportunity to accept Christ and accused them of leading others astray because they did not seek to understand what the Torah said about Messiah.

    People today are no different except that it is our responsibility as Christians to tell people who Jesus is and warn them of what it means not to accept Him and what is coming for the world.

    Jesus went away so that the Holy Spirit could come, there is a time coming when the Holy Spirit will once again be taken up and we with Him.

    Jesus said clearly the world will not accept us, because it does not accept Him.

    Prepare to be laughed at, ridiculed and even be put to death for believing what the Bible says and especially for making a stand for Jesus of Nazareth as being the Son of God, the Messiah, King of Kings, Lord of Lords and God on earth.

    Because the Bible says He is and the Holy Spirit in me confirms He is and I believe both and accept both to be true.

    Steve

  2. BruceC says:

    I remember a few years ago while my wife and I were at her sister’s home we were discussing Biblical matters; and her sister stated that the Bible was written by men and had errors in it. I asked her to please give me one example; to which she could not answer. Her only response was that men are not perfect and therefore what they write cannot be. So maybe the person who convinced of this “fact” should have been questioned by her? But no. I told her that a perfect and all knowing and all powerful God is fully capable of inspiring man to write His Word as He commands and get it right, even though man is flawed.
    It is the Holy Spirit that moved men to write the words of God. She stopped talking and became upset; changing the subject.
    The only thing that really stands out about this is that she regularly attends the church of her denomination that has been the traditional church of her family.
    So like the Pharisees of the time of our Lord, they miss the point. And not only that, but do not credit God with the power of getting His own Word across to us without error.
    The have ears but do not hear, and eyes but do not see. They are blind, leading the blind.
    As I see more and more “churches” revising the Word to fit their agenda and even denouncing long-held Biblical truth for the comfort of tolerance and correctness; I see what many believe to be the falling away as spoken of in the Word. Much of this has been brought on by the sages of our time who are no more than those wise in their own eyes and whose intellect is used to liberate them from the commands of God and His Holiness and place themselves under the bondage of darkness and sin. It also proves that because one attends church or adheres to a certain denomination does not mean they are saved.

    BruceC
    Soli Deo Gloria!

  3. remarutho says:

    Good Morning Mart & Friends!

    I am grateful you have chosen to focus upon the revealed Word of God, Mart. We float in the Sargasso of comparative religion when we do not set an anchor into the Bible. I say this because of the stated purpose of RBC’s website, ministries and blogs. Comparing systems of ethics and world-views is a worthwhile pursuit – but it is a separate one in my humble opinion.

    Mart, you wrote:
    “Not until a guarded tomb was found empty, and groups of disciples were reunited with their resurrected Teacher did they begin to see how he put the words and sentences of the ages in a whole new light.”

    Somehow your reference to the most meaningful passages of the New Testament (Jesus’ resurrection and 40 days fellowship with his disciples) brings me to the moment in which we now stand, as the Church. We celebrate, simply or elaborately, the Christ the King festival (Sunday, Nov. 25th this year). We turn a page now, from remembering the future when the Ruler of the universe is on the scene and sets all things right – to celebrating the seed-moment when a tiny, helpless Son of David is born in a stable in the hills of Bethlehem. We begin next Sunday to tell the story of Zacharias struck dumb in the temple, Mary traveling to see her relative Elizabeth, and Joseph’s change of heart after an angel vision.

    Christians rehearse the history of Messiah – all year long! We do other things: feed the hungry, clothe the naked and heal the sick…But, we are called most of all to lead people into worship of Jesus Messiah. We continue to tell the story! It seems to me the birth of Jesus is one of the “most unexpected” events in all Scripture.

    Who knew? Mary and Joseph and their families knew, because God revealed it to them. The shepherds found out in a sudden burst of heavenly glory, then came to see the baby King. Afterward, according to Matthew, several wise men from the East learned of the presence of Messiah from the Hebrew Bible, and journeyed to see the wonder.

    The truth of Christ is seen in Moses, in Job and in all the prophets. I cannot answer how these many authors wove such a coherent tapestry of God’s love – but I have seen a little of it – and it is wondrous!

    Blessings,
    Maru

  4. oneg2dblu says:

    Mart, yes, it is as you have said: “Today we are as they were– in the middle of the drama of the universe, knowing more than those who went before us, but still not able to see clearly what lies ahead.”
    As it was in Moses day, in Isaiah’s words, and in Romans 10:16, 17, 18, 19, 20, and 21
    Today, we are as they were, Romans 11:7, 8, 9, 10, 11, and 12.

    Then, we have our present day situation and as it stands today, not really believed by those who claim they are already and forever saved by their faith, “No matter what!”
    Romans 11:17, 18, 19, 20.
    The warning from Paul: Romans 11:21, “For if God did not spare the original branches, He won’t spare you either… and this following verse 22, clearly in the middle of the drama presented here, but must be denied by many today, as they are still not able to see what lies ahead in Romans 11:22 NIV
    “Notice how God is both kind and severe. He is sever toward those who disobeyed, but kind to you if you continue to trust in his kindness. But, if you stop trusting, you also will be cut off.”
    That is a condition of believer’s security as it clearly says. “IF” you continue to trust in his kindness, but “If” you stop, you WILL be cut off!
    To me, many have been falsely taught today about their free will choice to walk away from sound teaching, just as in Romans 11:8.
    Just a thought… Gary

  5. oneg2dblu says:

    Sorry, my verse all came from the NLT.

  6. kingdomkid7 says:

    In an ongoing (but post-Thanksgiving) spirit of gratitude, thanks to you Steve, Bruce C and Maru for sharing so insightfully. Thanks Mart for the wonderful topic. And thanks, Gary, for being you!! Love you guys!!

  7. poohpity says:

    Mart, I find it so amazing that at one time there was not the little cross reference notes or chapters or verses. That the manuscripts were separate and may not have been much more than a diary that the prophets kept during their time but were so interwoven because of the One common thread, their experience talking with God. Their recorded history. Gee I had not even realized that the bible was not put together in Chronological order but in the order of law, history, major and minor prophets and the NT in order of Gospels, epistles and prophesy.

    There is so much to learn and experience but it is so eery or maybe I should say Spiritual. Then when Jesus taught about Himself on the road to Emmaus and brought all the OT scripture to life that was foretold about Him then new wonder is opened up. I do not know how anyone would not want to read this book that has lived over all these ages and is a living thing that continues to teach and just when you think you have got it down a new teaching appears it seems to grow as you grow.

    The very wonder of it all, the very wonder of our God everyday amazes me and takes my breath away. We are given a picture of God and the experience of those before us who have experienced and then when we look at our lives we find so much in common with so many others around the world that bring us together, it is amazing.

    I wonder what our history books will look like about our times and how many of the flaws they will leave out and lies told just so our leaders will look good. I wonder if they will record all the genocide of millions of people around the world at the hands of those who would want to be a god to the people they rule over?

  8. poohpity says:

    With the bible there is no such thing as sinners anonymous it is all right there in the open and the One who brings the healing.

  9. davids says:

    I need to write something up for our church for Advent, and some things expressed here have been a great inspiration! Thanks, and may Advent be a blessed time for all.

  10. castaway says:

    The fact that the words of Scripture proceeded from one rational divine mind implies that it should exhibit perfect coherence despite the 40 authors who wrote it over a period of 1500 years. This is what we find in the Bible. Although the personality and literary style of each writer is evident, the design and the unity of the Bible indicate a single divine author. Each scriptural document exhibits perfect internal consistency, and all the documents are consistent with one another. The Bible never contradicts itself. Jesus affirms the coherence of Scripture, and He assumes this in all of His teachings and applications of the Bible.

    Scientists and non-Christians use this fact among others(40 authors or more and a period of 1500 years or more) to wallow in the supposed realm of contradictions, but Christians must not tolerate them. Rather than abandoning the unity of Scripture or the law of non-contradiction as a “defense” against those who assert that biblical doctrines contradict themselves, we must affirm and demonstrate the perfect harmony of these doctrines. On the other hand, Christians should expose the incoherence of non-Christian beliefs, and challenge their adherents to abandon their false premise and consider the fact…what if the Bible is true?

    We must ever affirm the truth of the Bible without apology, even if it was penned by those who were not “qualified” to do so.

    BTW, I disagree that we cannot “see what lies ahead” so please clarify.

  11. poohpity says:

    You know what is going to happen tomorrow?? Or the day after that? It would seem that only God has that ability but I could be wrong. We are only given a glimpse of the future just as the prophets were told what would happen in the future if things did not change but most did not really understand how their prophesies would be fulfilled in Christ until He pointed them out as to what the scriptures meant. Luke 24:27 NLT

  12. SFDBWV says:

    In reading over my thoughts I sound a bit harsh on “intellectuals”. I actually strained at finding the proper word for those among us that *worship* knowledge and the pursuit of it.

    I am not condemning such an adventure as I believe there to be many among us who pursue knowledge and maybe consider themselves to be intellectual, and also believers.

    The problem exists when very intelligent people are confronted with what may seem very difficult to accept statements from the Bible.

    I believe Paul ran up against such people when he gave His Mars Hills speech.

    They listened intently until Paul claimed that Jesus had risen from the grave. Then they left scoffing and laughing at such a *story*.

    Even among believers there are many who *choose* what they can accept from scripture and sort of don’t talk or think too much on things they may have reservations about because *educated* thinking questions the absolutes of what scripture may proclaim.

    If I were to walk into a biology or Astronomy class in most any college and proclaim that God created everything that exists in 6 24 hour periods (six days) would any one accept what I have said to be accurate?

    I accept it to be accurate only because of the Book of Genesis, in spite of what the *intellectual* world believes and continues to define.

    If I were to go into a medical college in a classroom filled with students learning about the biology and delicate function of neurology, and proclaim that a man named Lazarus had been dead for four days and returned to life without loss of any neurological function, how do you suppose my claims would be received?

    For me believing what the Bible says, means believing all of it or none of it, I can not choose which part to accept and which to ignore.

    Historians may have a tendency to accept the fact that the Bible gives the less flattering look at human nature as well as the more noble and agree it has the potential to be believed because of that psychological honesty; but then do they believe that a man named Jesus actually lived, died and returned to life under His own power because of that base?

    There is a supernatural connection between you and God and that supernatural connection is what gives you the ability to accept Christ as well as all that Scripture has to offer as truth. Not the intellectual pursuit of dissecting scripture to the point of accepting it to be *believable* solely on an intellectual process.

    Steve

  13. BruceC says:

    Good morning to all of the family this chilly November day.

    Good post Steve. I too have difficulty finding the right word to use and wind up using “intellectual” as well. I use it mainly to describe those who are highly educated; but without the wisdom given by God; they are only wise “in their own eyes” and those of their ilk. Most of our populace today are impressed with these people and seem to absorb every word that rolls off their lips as if it were from God Himself. Almost cult-like. These people do not know real faith, although those that cling to evolution have less proof than we and thereby may exhibiting a very high degree of faith in their belief. But it is a deceived and misplaced faith.
    The wisdom from God is pure and is based in His Holy Word and believed in by both faith and proof that has been offered. It is not anything like the wisdom or the wise of this world.
    These men of “knowledge” operate in our four dimensional world and cannot see beyond that. I heard an interesting statement on a Christian TV channel yesterday. They spoke about how Ronald Reagan made a comment to a Russian audience via radio in their language. He said that if you were invited to the best banquet ever held and served the best food; would you be willing to believe there was no cook? That is what many intellectuals do every day. Eat the food and claim that there is no cook.
    Without faith it is impossible to please God.
    I have read where some people who do weaving as a craft or hobby sometimes use different types of thread, different thicknesses, and of varying colors to achieve their desired outcome in the end product. This is what our heavenly Father has done with His Perfect Word.

    Please keep my friend Warren in your prayers. He is in his 70’s and has health issues and now needs dialysis. He is a Veteran, started a local moving company, has farmed and raised beef. The greatest thing about Warren is that he came to the Lord just a couple of years ago and was baptized at our church picnic. So the Lord’s hand is always stretched out to save regardless of ones age. His Name be praised!

    God Bless All,

    BruceC
    Soli Deo Gloria

  14. SFDBWV says:

    Bruce, thank you for the salvation report on Warren, sorry to hear of his impending dialysis, prayers for him indeed.

    “Getting older ain’t what it’s been cracked up to be”. I’ve heard that statement my entire life and it is as true today as when I first heard it.

    Steve

  15. dja says:

    Good Morning Everyone,

    Steve, thank you for your wonderful posts! My husband and I always say, “This getting old is getting old!” Like you said-“It ain’t what it’s been cracked up to be.” Thankfully, the Lord’s mercies are new every morning, and we rejoice in the strength He gives us each day!

    Bruce, I am a weaver, and the excitement for me as a weaver is planning the project with various kinds of thread and seeing it come together. Working out the details on paper and then warping the loom and watching the pattern come to life with each pass of the shuttle is rewarding as I begin to see the end product.

    As I was reading your entry, Bruce, the following poem came to mind:

    The Weaver
    by Benjamin Malacia Franklin
    (Originally titled, “Just a Weaver”)

    My life is just a weaving
    Between my Lord and me.
    I cannot change the color
    For He works most steadily.

    Oft times He weaves the sorrow
    And I in foolish pride
    Forget He sees the upper
    And I the underside.

    Until the loom is silent
    And the shuttle cease to fly,
    Will God roll back the canvas
    And explain the reason why.

    The dark threads are as needful
    In the skillful Weaver’s Hand
    As the golden threads of silver
    He has patterned in His Plan.

    Thank you for sharing about Warren. I will be praying for him as I pray for you all.

    Up to 32 degrees this morning in NEPA. Snow yesterday, but it looks to be clear for the rest of the week. They say it may reach 50 on Friday:-) Have a blessed day!
    ~Della

  16. poohpity says:

    Mart, I would love to hear others expand on your topic but as usual it has taken a downward spiral to put downs and picking apart those who are different. It is wrong to have an education or to have bible knowledge, go figure. I have always enjoyed talking with those who are more knowledgeable and know so much more about the bible but I guess it is a threat to those who lack both.

  17. kingdomkid7 says:

    Pooh, I would not address you directly, if I didn’t think it might help what seems to be a misunderstanding on your part. I don’t think that anyone is putting down anyone. I heard Steve and Bruce to be saying that many intellectuals see themselves as too sophisticated for the foolishness of Bible believing. It seems clear that you are not one of those people.
    But we all know it to be true that the Word of God is foolishness to those who are perishing, and I think that’s all they were pointing to.
    I am well educated but know beyond a doubt that — before I came to Jesus — my degrees bought me a boatload of pride and ignorance about God. I am so grateful that He took the time to show Himself to me, but there are SO many others like I used to be who are still perishing, because they worship their intelligence, their accomplishments, their point of view — the list is a long one. These are the people I pray for perhaps most, because I know how very lost and blind they are.
    So I just have trouble seeing a put-down in this recognition. It’s not anti-intellectual. It’s just telling the truth.

  18. poohpity says:

    kingdom, I have to say thank you for addressing me personally and not speaking in the third person but I still do not have a clue how that fits in with the topic. I would just like for a change to venture into Mart’s topics and expand on them. It would not be a putdown if the intellectuals they were speaking of had the ability to speak up for themselves and not assume in what they think or see. If one is not an intellectual how can someone else guess what is going on in them. It is not truth to assume or jump to conclusions.

  19. foreverblessed says:

    The plot line of Mart, that as much as the disciples didn’t know what was going to happen, so we hardly see what is in the future. Did the disciples see that Jesus was to be crucified? As it was all in the Old testament, but they could not put that together.
    So we look into the future, and probably we do not put things together as God has already laid out in the bible. Is all that is described in Revelation, is it put together in such a way that we can’t see it now beforehand, unless it it revealed to us by the Holy Spirit.

    And what about an earth which is much older then 6000 years, would that make God any less the Creator, would it mean Genesis 1 and 2 is wrong? Or are we interpreting things in the wrong way? Even in the aftermath it is still hard to see what Genesis 1 means to say. How much more the things that are still in the future.
    But we are to live now, Today is the day, Today I can walk in faith behind Jesus, walk as He walks before me. He will show us, when time is due to know more.

  20. kingdomkid7 says:

    Ok, Pooh. I see what you are saying. I would say also, though, that the topic of the Bible’s credibility that Mart has opened can fit the observations by some — and I definitely agree with them — that one obstacle to the “credibility” of God’s Word to those who don’t believe is that their own sense of intellectual superiority gets in the way. They see foolish fables that are not worth their time.
    So the observations about those Biblical nay-sayers seems to be on-topic, not off-topic as I see it. And I’m personally not at all bothered by the fact that the Bible-detractors are not here to defend themselves. I’m praying for them, and I’m sure I’m not alone in that.

  21. oneg2dblu says:

    I do not know how I ended up on another topic first, but trust it was beyond my control as just wanted to share this verse, 1 Corinthians 1:27 NIV.
    I believe the bible states that a day is like a thousand years to God, because He lives outside of time as we know it.
    I do not buy our interpretation of the seven 24 hour days of modern man as the basis for all of what we know about Creation, for our timing does not make any difference in time for God. His timing is His, and is always perfect. Just ask Him!
    What amazes me is that one man, way back then called Moses, when under the inspiration of Almighy God wrote the first 24 verses in Genesis about the unfolding of all Creation, and maknid so far has not with all “his modern inteligence,” ever found it to be wrong. Go figure that one!
    I do like the, As long as it is caled “today” references in the bible though, because they usher in a different timing than our ever ticking 24 hour clock.
    Be Blessed, Gary

  22. poohpity says:

    It brings to mind that old saying, “If you can’t dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bull.” by W.C. Fields

    To me it is so neat that although the writers of the OT who did not know each other yet spoke of much of the same things over all and over a very long period of time that although the manuscripts were not seen by others then after the resurrection Jesus used all those manuscripts to show how they pointed to Him. It is like it was all written with that intent but they weren’t or it did not seem to be at the time. The cross references we have now were not there then. If I am not mistaken that is how different manuscripts were kept in the bible, if they were able to be cross referenced with other manuscripts then they were put in the bible.

    Then on top of it all it has lasted all this time. It would seem that it would damage the church and Israel to mention all their shortcomings, moral or social failures but most people would want to elevate themselves by not sharing those things. After all it is not about us but seems to be about our God and from many different peoples coming to the same conclusions.

    It may have even been God’s desire for the written language to have Moses born in Egypt to learn, I do not know what they are called, but those picture words so it could be the start of the recorded record.

  23. kingdomkid7 says:

    I don’t understand the W.C. Fields reference. To what does that refer, Pooh?

  24. BruceC says:

    pooh,

    Those picture words that you speak of are Egyptian hieroglyphics. They are all over the tombs and other buildingds of that time.
    I think you misunderstood my outlook on “intellectuals”; and maybe I should have been clearer. Sorry.

    BruceC
    Soli Deo Gloria!

  25. davids says:

    Steve, I was happy to see you moderate you comment about intellectuals. There are many that study the sciences that believe in God’s revelation through scripture.

    To expand on Gary’s point a bit, we accept that Daniel uses weeks to refer to years, or perhaps another time frame. I think that we accept that other prophesies are represented symbolically as well.

    Therefore, I can accept that the Bible might present certain historical aspects in the same way. It doesn’t meant that the stories of the Exodus are not history. It simply recognizes that throughout the Bible there is a certain amount of prophetic symbolism and metaphor, as when we say that Jesus is the son of David.

    Viewed in this way helps many people accept the Bible in line with the two points Mart makes in this topic, and allows them to come to Christ without compromising the moral meaning of his suffering.

    I’ve probably made myself persona non grata here by now :)

  26. castaway says:

    To enlarge on the point I believe Pooh is making, if I may…

    Two people can observe the same thing and come up with contradictory interpretations. However, this does not need to result in relativism, since one person will likely be correct or at least closer to the truth and the other may be wrong. It depends on which one has the correct presuppositions about the universe in general, and about the object that is under observation in particular. And let’s not kid ourselves, everyone has presuppositions when it comes to the Bible, no one is without an opinion.

    Our presuppositions determine the interpretation of what we observe, so that the wrong
    presuppositions will lead to a false interpretation of the Bible. One need only to observe the minefield of “christian denominations” to see the havoc this has wrought on the church as a whole. The number of men and women claiming to be evangelicals and yet who do not believe the Bible in its’ entirety is alarming to say the least.

    From Matthew 12:22-28 we see how presuppositions can cost one eternal life; it concerns the authority of Christ to expel demons:

    “Then they brought him a demon-possessed man who was blind and mute, and Jesus healed him, so that he could both talk and see. All the people were astonished and said, ‘Could this be the Son of David?’ But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, ‘It is only by Beelzebub, the prince of demons that this fellow drives out demons'” (v. 22-24).

    Based on their observation of the event, the audience is prepared to consider at least the possibility that Jesus is the Christ, but the Pharisees, who observed the same event, say that he expels demons by the power of Satan.

    Christ’s reply indicates that not all interpretations are correct:

    “Every kingdom divided against itself will be ruined, and every city or household divided against itself will not stand. If Satan drives out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then can his kingdom stand? And if I drive out demons by Beelzebub, by whom do your people drive them out? So then, they will be your judges. But if I drive out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.” (v. 25-28)

    Jesus reduces their assertion to absurdity, and then he gives the right interpretation of the event, and concludes with an implication about the gospel.

    If the Pharisees truly believed the Scripture, they should have arrived at the same interpretation about Christ as what Christ asserted about himself. But although they claimed to believe the Scripture, in reality they suppressed the truth about it. Although in the Scripture they had access to the right presuppositions or knowledge by which they could correctly interpret reality, because of their wickedness they refused to accept these presuppositions and their implications, and thus they rejected the truth by suppressing and distorting it.

    We need this kind of courage today, but alas it is rare! Like a precious jewel, someone who believes in the Bible as it is written and who loves it so is a rare find indeed. (forgive my lapse into 19th century English but us intellectuals express ourselves every now and then.)

  27. poohpity says:

    kingdom, to me that is how some of the conversations seem to go.

    Thanks Bruce could not think of that word for the life of me. You know how good I am at misunderstanding over these many years.

  28. kingdomkid7 says:

    What conversations?

  29. poohpity says:

    I guess you would have to venture back over the last 2 or 3 years and see for yourself.

  30. kingdomkid7 says:

    I doubt I would ever see things in that W.C. Fields way. It sounds like a somewhat negative assessment that I might be tempted to make too often if I ever let myself go there. I still view this site (blog) as a pleasant, informative and usually positive forum, so I’ll just leave it at that.

  31. poohpity says:

    I think WC Fields is rather funny while being very honest and spot on with his assessments of life.

  32. kingdomkid7 says:

    Perhaps Fields generally is funny, honest, etc. The quote I responded to that you made earlier sounds a bit cynical to me, and that’s why I asked about it. I couldn’t see where it applied. Now I see it was more of “insider’s reference.”
    I’ve just finished preparing for tomorrow’s class, so I have no more curiosity left.
    Night!!

  33. remarutho says:

    Good Morning Mart & Friends –

    The appearance of our resurrected Lord Jesus Christ utterly transformed the lives of those who saw, heard and learned from him those weeks he remained among them. His command to remain in Jerusalem and his promise recorded by Luke still guide us: “you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit, not many days from now.’” (Acts 1:4)

    Mart, you wrote:
    “Today we are as they were– in the middle of the drama of the universe, knowing more than those who went before us, but still not able to see clearly what lies ahead.”

    The process of discernment we are called to, continues to be shaped by what was given in the last few days before Jesus ascended. When Jesus gathered his disciples, they asked him a seemingly superficial question: “Lord, is it at this time you are restoring the kingdom to Israel?” (v 6)

    Jesus tells them “It is not for you to know times or epochs which the Father has fixed by his own authority…” (v 7) So it is with us. We do not see at the moment the scope of God’s working in history and in people movements. As with the disciples, we often ask how we will see favor or benefit from the Lord. The gift given by the resurrected Lord Jesus and by the Father puts us in the flow of the Lord’s will: “…but you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be my witnesses both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and even to the remotest part of the earth.” (v 8)

    It seems to me the discernment of those who truly seek to follow Jesus is guided by prayer, the shaping of the Word – and unity in action that tests and proves (or disproves) our discernment. It is our God who determines outcomes. We see this again and again in the Scriptural story of God with his people.

    Blessings,
    Maru

  34. davids says:

    Castaway, your posting was very clearly presented. Thanks!

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