Text Size: Zoom In

Three Women Found

DSC01494The report of three women found alive in Cleveland, Ohio after they went missing about a decade ago is the kind of news we could live for. While much information isn’t yet available, it appears that all three were abducted in separate incidents and held captive, for 10 years,  in a normal looking home with neighbors completely unaware of their plight.

As I think about the joy and sweet taste of freedom that these women and their families are experiencing today, the story keeps getting bigger. Am trying to imagine how many around us are living in a silent captivity created by the cruelty of a parent, spouse, stranger, or worse.

The worse is the real story.

On the surface, much of our human captivity appears to be the unintended results of our own choices. Yet the deeper explanation is of an enemy who has deceived us, and who is responsible for holding us in an imposed confinement that we don’t begin to understand until Christ sets us free.

Without this bigger picture, we are probably inclined to be critical of and uncaring for those who seem to be responsible for their own misery. Yet, even while acknowledging that all of us are accountable to the Lord for our own choices, who can deny that there is a real self-absorbed sadist, of the most extreme kind, who under the cover of invisibility holds us captive in our own sins…

Maybe that’s why angels rejoice over such rescues– while demons remain convinced that such mercy isn’t deserved.

(Isa 61:1)


Vote on whether you think this post is something you'll be thinking about:
Vote This Post DownVote This Post Up (+22 rating, 23 votes)
Loading...
33 Comments »

33 Responses to “Three Women Found”

  1. swwagner says:

    I know all about being a captive in your own home and in your own skin. I know about being treated badly and reminded daily of sins and short comings. I know about being obedient to the point of personality deformation. I know about being controlled by personal sins and the sins of others. Yet, in the midst of captivity, the Lord comes and sets us free…He is not bound by the geography of real or imposed locks. He unlocks the chains in our soul even though outer circumstances don’t change. It is not a coincidence that Jesus broke the chains of hell. Praise Him! Praise Him!

  2. tracey5tgbtg says:

    A good reason why we shouldn’t judge another. We can’t see the chains that are binding them. Jesus said to love our enemies, not curse them. Only the love of Jesus Christ can set the captives free, not condemnation.

    Scripture quote from “Matthew’s Table,” Matt 9:13 “I desire mercy, not sacrifice.”

  3. AmazedbyHis grace says:

    When my child first fell into sin, I wrote a poem referring to explain how and why we fall. Here’s an excerpt from “Butterfly’s Honeybee’s, You and Me.” (This has a copyright. I don’t want to show my name and as of the 1980’s we don’t have to show the copyright.)

    The intricate detail of a spider’s webbed maze,
    Draws me closer, closer, ensnared in a daze.
    The beauty, the shimmer, enticement ablaze!
    The spider is filled with desire of craze.

    We are the biggest problems that caused our tragedies, but then we tend to ask God, why did You allow this? If we were on the narrow path before we chose our day, our mate, our everything, then we would have argument. His grace rose above our shortcomings and He sees us through any life choice and still blesses us! Our focus should be repentance and stepping over the line of grace onto the good path, walking with the Lord.

  4. remarutho says:

    Good Morning BTA Folks –

    Mart, you very rightly ask: “who can deny that there is a real self-absorbed sadist, of the most extreme kind, who under the cover of invisibility holds us captive in our own sins…” (?)

    It seems to me the most vulnerable souls among us are those who objectify the Creator God as well as Satan. When dismissed as mere “forces” or “principles,” the great Savior (as well as the great accuser) of humanity disappears in the misery of material reality. Hence, the individual or group who boasts of being “free” from the “demands” of a mythical god or gods is the very one blind, deaf and defenseless in the face of evil. The Stoic rugged individualist believes that (s)he stands strong against all forces that would prevail over his/her freedom. At that very moment evil is in control – and sets about to destroy real freedom, joy and community. Darkness engulfs the spirits of people.

    The story of the three women imprisoned by sadists is tragic. Both the prisoners and the jailers are enmeshed in the sticky web of the deceiver. By grace the one young woman reached out to a neighbor when she experienced a moment of opportunity to escape, seizing it after a decade of agony.

    This one case is heart-breaking in its cruelty. Suffering has plagued the women’s families and neighborhoods. But it seems to me the systems – political, religious and cultural – that keep whole populations in want and despair are greater evils – strongholds of Satan’s unchecked working in hearts and minds.

    We have Jesus’ promise that he establishes the community of his believers (the church), and the gates of Hades will not prevail against it. (Matthew 16:18, 19) The fulfillment of this divine prophetic promise, it seems to me, calls for prayerful vigilance and Spirit-led action in the world. Praying for evil systems to be exposed is step one in resisting the devil. (James 4:7)

    Maru

  5. swwagner says:

    AmazedbyHisgrace: I agree that our own sin leads us to wrong mates and wrong choices. God rescued me from that darkness with little bits of scripture that showed me the way out of fear. (“The fear of man is a snag” and the “Fear of the Lord is good”.) However, sometimes God does allow pain for our own refinement (Job) and He does answer our lack of understanding and even our anger with quiet truth that stills our hearts and mouths.

    As for the three women and their families…I am at a loss to explain this evil. This is not a choice they made. Just like it was not the choice of Corrie TenBoom to be put in a prison camp. I am so looking forward to the time when all wrongs will be made right.

    tracey5tgbtg: I agree with your comment that only the love of Jesus can set captives free

    remarutho: I agree that the true problem is the hater of men, Satan. We can’t stand against Him alone.

  6. SFDBWV says:

    If a person lived completely alone never speaking with anyone else, never seeing the news or having any contact with the rest of the world what would their outlook on life be?

    There is no equal or opposite in power to God. Satan is a created being who we are told very little of except that it was he who suggested to Eve that God was not telling her and Adam the whole truth.

    That he (Satan) leads a rebellion in heaven to achieve *what*?

    That he tests Jesus for forty days in the wilderness, in order for it to be possible for Jesus to overcome temptation.

    That he (Satan) is able to possess a human, but not all humans at once.

    It isn’t the person of Satan we need concern ourselves with, but rather the spiritual influence evil has on the spirits of men.

    Sin in my opinion is condensed down to one word, *self*.

    Since I live amongst other men and not alone without any contact or observations of others, I am unable to completely ignore all others around me. Ignoring them would be the only way possible for me not to have opinions of their behavior. Ignoring them might actually be a worse attitude then paying attention to them, and if I pay attention to others, I will have an opinion of them and there is a very fine line between an observation then an opinion and making a judgment of that behavior. Usually dividing it between good and evil.

    Even a person who says they don’t think it *proper* for someone to make such a *judgment* concerning the behavior of another is in fact guilty of judging that person themselves.
    No one can escape such a trap. The trick is what we do with such observations and how we either help an offender, or ignore them.

    A person who is offensive to others is not concerned with doing good, quite the opposite it is their intent to disrupt life and place themselves in the center of attention…self.

    Do we then as followers and imitators of Jesus ignore such a person or point out their sin (captivity) (misery) in an attempt to help that person out of the ditch and onto the road?

    Are we helping a person who is sinning against us by forgiving them and not mentioning their trespass against us to them?

    If we have an unrepentant offender, and we forgive them, is it then in their best interests to go unpunished?

    Our choices are made to either enhance self or someone else.

    Jesus set us free to be able to have power over evil, it is then our choice alone as to how we use such *freedom*. No one to blame but ourselves and God to thank for the *freedom* to choose *wisely*.

    Steve

  7. poohpity says:

    The bible teaches a different way other than ignoring or pointing out their sin. Proverbs 25:21-22; Matt 5:43-48; Matt 7:1-5; Romans 12:20

  8. poohpity says:

    If I feel the mercy that I have obtained from God is deserved then I will expect others to make it a point to earn mine. I am therefor held captive to earning God’s love and the love of others.

    David even after being considered a man after God’s own heart, sinned. When God promised him that someone from His family would sit on the throne for eternity his response was; 2 Samuel 7:19-21 NLT; 1 Chron 17:19-20. He could have been held captive to his transgressions but He understood that God showed him mercy because of who God was not because of anything David could do.

    The adversary wants us to believe we have to earn something that is given so freely to the undeserving that is what sets us free. So do we hold others to the standard that God did not hold us to? If we are kind to those who are angry or hate us is that not what God did for us while we were yet sinners He showed us a kindness called grace, undeserved favor.

  9. oneg2dblu says:

    What if your enemy is the ongoing repetitive lifestyle of sin embraced by your brothers in Christ?

    Do you then invite teir lifestyle in for a good feeding?

    No, we are to hate sin, all sin.

    But, if we can’t judge good from evil, then we have a greater problem, called a very lacking discernment, or a dead blinded spirit.

    Warning our brothers about sin, in not an evil we will be judged for.
    But the sin of omission, about not warning our brothers who go on sinning, may be held accountable to us according to the some other teachings in the holy bible.

    Ezekiel 3:20, 21 “Again, when a righteous man turns from his righteousness and does evil, and I put a stumbling block before him, he will die. Since you did not warn him, he will die for his sin. The righteous things he did will not be remembered, and I will hold you accountable for his blood. But if you do warn the righteous man not to sin and he does not sin, he will surely live because he took the warning, and you will have saved yourself.
    I do not believe it is the duty of a righteous, saved, Chrsitian to not warn his brothers about sin in their lives today, to do so would be to intentionally omit what the scriptures say about all those warnings given to the righteous man, those already saved among us.
    There will be an accounting of what we did with all our time, gifts, and all our god-given knowledge, after our salvation as well.
    Or, have I been mis-led?
    Gary

  10. oneg2dblu says:

    Steve…
    Satan is the father of lies, he is a thief and he has come to steal, kill, and destroy.
    He is certainly doing a his intended job with all the sins in marriage, abortion, and ungodly sexual desires, among our brothers in Christ today.
    It makes me wonder who’s voice we hear when we think we are so free from sin, because we claim we were once saved from our sins?

    In John 8:34 “Christ teaches, “Every one who sins is a slave to sin.”

    If we believe we can not serve two masters without loving one and hating the other, as Christ teaches, then those who are serving Christ and live as a slave to sin, have a real doctrinal problem. IMHO
    Gary

  11. poohpity says:

    Gary, it is not being mis-lead it is only considering part of a truth while neglecting the whole truth. It is a very slippery slope and needs to be done with great care and kindness by first considering the condition of our own hearts. Romans 2:1-4 NLT

  12. oneg2dblu says:

    If you feel you have received something called mercy, which you say is not deservered because you were not held to a standard, then how do you relate that to then deserving something from others?

    What do your feelings have to say?

    If you feel above reproach, conviction, or taking any warning from anyone other than God, then your feelings have already judged for you.

    I trust we are not now saying God has no standards.

    He has set his standards in His word.

    “I will show mercy to whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.”

    I believe God’s standard is that He decides whom He will bless.

    But, there were Laws to Justice and Mercy

    Do not spread false reports, have nothing to do with a false charge. Do not follow the crowd in doing wrong. Do not deny justice or show favoritism to your poor people in their lawsuits. Do not accept a bribe. Do not oppress an alien.

    I’ll assume we could all agree with those found in Exodus as being some god-given standards still worth following today.

  13. poohpity says:

    Gary, I never feel above reproach, correction or being held accountable but those who care for my well being will do it in love. Not in condemnation, name calling, belittling or criticism but in a way that will help me grow. Presenting me with facts, being accurate and honest, affirming the good, being gentle, speaking words that reflect Christ’s message, not their own ideas and in that show their spirituality and trust in God realizing that we all need God’s grace. Otherwise it is just done to cause hurt, retaliation, malice and evil. Galatians 6:1-3 NIV

  14. remarutho says:

    Good Evening Mart & Friends –

    Each person I have talked with since the liberation of the three captive women in Cleveland is amazed that the imprisonment was so long: nine, ten and eleven years for each of the three respectively. It is shocking that three middle aged men managed to dominate them for so long – just behind the closed doors of a house everyone walked by every day. What terrorist tactics were used? How frightened the women must have been for so many years! I imagine the men will say the women chose imprisonment, or even liked it. Still, Messiah’s words resound: “The Lord has anointed me…to proclaim liberty to the captives and release to the prisoners…” (Isaiah 61:1)

    Mart, you wrote:
    “On the surface, much of our human captivity appears to be the unintended results of our own choices. Yet the deeper explanation is of an enemy who has deceived us, and who is responsible for holding us in an imposed confinement that we don’t begin to understand until Christ sets us free.”

    You are speaking of our slavery to sin. We are trapped, even though the chains (of addiction, self-worship or greed) are invisible. The drug dealer and the user, the abuser and the abused, the thief and the victim are all held in and captive to the evil one. The exposed sadists in Cleveland are as imprisoned as the women they preyed upon all that time. Satan still deceives any and all he can.

    The dark kingdom the men created that remained invisible all those years is now exposed to the light – and how ugly it is. Fear, intimidation, lies and cruelty are tools of deception. Ms. Berry overcame her terror long enough to ask Mr. Ramsey for help. We all celebrate the freedom that has resulted. The women and the little girl walking out of that house are an emblem and a picture of Life in Jesus. He reminds us, “See, I am making all things new.” (Revelation 21:5) It is a salvation story.

    Blessings,
    Maru

  15. SFDBWV says:

    This news story will grow then fade from the public view, but the problem of being addicted to sin will stay.

    I use the term addicted here rather than in slavery to because while it is true we once were held in bondage to sin Jesus set all of us free at the cross. Free except to our own choices, just as in the beginning when Adam and Eve chose the lie over the truth.

    A person who still blames their own bad choices on someone else other than themselves is still blaming someone else for their sin, just as Adam did when God confronted him, he blamed Eve, and Eve blamed the serpent.

    Once again I am reminded of the comic Flip Wilson who did a comedy routine all based on the line “The devil made me do it!”

    What of a person who continues to not recognize their sin as being sin yet considers themselves *clean* because they confess Jesus to be Lord?

    As Mart stated “we are probably inclined to be critical of and uncaring for those who seem to be responsible for their own misery.” This is very true of most all of us.

    Right now while we look at the pictures of the men who held these women captive for 10 years and hear of their cruelty to these 3 women, do we feel they are not responsible for their actions because they chose to follow their own self serving interests at the expense of the freedom and torment of others?

    Or do we see them also as being bound to their sin as an addict is to their habit?

    Is it somehow then wrong for us to feel critical of the actions of these men?
    If these men beg the court for mercy what then should the judge do?

    God is a just God and requires justice, which is why Jesus was sacrificed for all men including these three *sadists*, so if they ask for mercy from you what would you do?

    Would you let them go free without punishment because you feel bound to because mercy was given you for sins against God? Or would you forgive them yet punish them for their actions against these three women?

    Justice is a scale and there must be a balance.

    So what is it, are these men responsible for their actions or are they only victims of being in bondage themselves as Flip Wilson might have said “The devil made them do it?”

    Steve

  16. AmazedbyHis grace says:

    smwagner: The thoughts of “why” when innocent situations lead to disaster has crossed my life as well. We don’t pray enough or teach our children to do so. If I was focused on the Lord as a young teen, praying His will, walking in the faith; I believe I wouldn’t have had many of the tragedies occur in my life. Perhaps this is the case in other peoples incidents.
    When people hear of the many tragedies in my life, I tell them I chose my own path, God’s grace saved me. If God gave me a choice of having the rough times and growth incurred or a padded life, I’d choose the rough and that includes a horrible loss of children. The growth was amazing but I was “souly,” deeply in tune to the Lord for this to happen.
    Some tragedies I believe are allowed as a testing and refining of faith. We generally don’t want to conform to His likeness by ourselves. You can’t see the rainbow in the midst of storms so it is in trials. If you listen to, not just read, God’s word, work it into your soul during the trials, you will agree with James 1:2-4 at trials end. Consider it pure joy, my brothers and sisters, whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith produces perseverance. Let perseverance finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything. James 1:2-4

  17. remarutho says:

    Good Morning All!

    It seems to me the civil and criminal justice systems derive from the Bible and Common Law, but beyond that retributive correction has nothing to do with the sin-nature. Incarceration cannot change the fallen human soul. Pleading for criminal justice is barking up the wrong tree here. The perpetrators of this horror will be prosecuted, probably to the full extent of the law in the State of Ohio.

    As I understand the level at which the topic is presented, the object is theological. Mart, you wrote:

    “On the surface, much of our human captivity appears to be the unintended results of our own choices. Yet the deeper explanation is of an enemy who has deceived us, and who is responsible for holding us in an imposed confinement that we don’t begin to understand until Christ sets us free.”

    We are totally depraved with no personal power to resist the wiles of the evil one by our own effort. God in Christ must reach us in order for the pattern of sinning to be broken. I agree with you, Mart, when you say, “Am trying to imagine how many around us are living in a silent captivity created by the cruelty of a parent, spouse, stranger, or worse.” Sin is systemic to the human condition. Only the Savior can cancel its power in our lives individually and collectively.

    Perhaps I have misunderstood the presentation of this topic. It is possible.

    Blessings,
    Maru

  18. poohpity says:

    Maru, I do not think you misunderstood at all.

    Some of the silent things that can hold us captive are an unforgiving heart that holds grudges, hostility and anger towards another. Bad and abusive parenting, abuse from a spouse, a stranger who has committed a horrible act like the Boston incident, a brother that lied about you, even if somethings were done intentionally or unintentionally as long as we never forgive, they have held us captive in a prison with invisible walls.

    With these women and what they decide to hold in their hearts toward their captors will determine whether they want true freedom or to continue being held captive my them. Letting God and the courts determine the consequences for these men and turning over their right to punish them, these women will do their self a big favor in going through the process of forgiveness. They will no longer be held captive.

  19. poohpity says:

    We seem to want forgiveness for our sins but we do not want others to be forgiven for theirs because we may see their crime as worse than ours.

  20. SFDBWV says:

    Maru you are right in saying there is a difference between theological sin and civil crimes for discussion purposes.

    We often discuss sin here in this community and with the exception of the sin of rejecting God all other sins are also civil wrongs against people as in the “Ten Commandments”.

    If we lie to another it is considered a sin, yet if we lie on an insurance claim or to a police officer or under oath in a court room it is also a crime.

    When I first became a Municipal judge there were and still are laws on the books that are theological or moral in intent such as sodomy, adultery, the use of profane language in public, prostitution and may I say homosexuality as referenced by sodomy.

    If you notice such *moral* laws are under attack to be removed from civil laws.

    A criminal has to first choose to violate a moral commandment in their heart before it becomes an act of civil disobedience in actually carrying it out.

    So it would be fair to say that a criminal is first a slave to their sin; the two interconnected and inseparable.

    Theologically speaking the only difference between a criminal and a non criminal is the act of carrying out the sin that has already been considered in the heart of a non criminal by the criminal.

    As Jesus taught by saying if we only think about doing it we are already guilty of doing it.

    Our societies are corrupted by the sin that is found in people, that sin when acted upon causes all of our social ills all of them.

    We can not separate this discussion into being only theological and not literal, because a literal sin is most often a criminal act.

    Once a crime has been committed or a trespass against another it is by nature a sin against God and the teaching of Christ, but it doesn’t end there; we then as caretakers of the world we are living in must exact justice concerning this act of evil against another, it can not be ignored or left to theology to talk to death. Some act of justice must follow and that in itself is in concert with the will of God for the community of man.

    Please don’t think I am in contention with you, I am only expanding on what I may already have tried to say.

    Steve

  21. kingdomkid7 says:

    Like Steve, I do not want to be in contention with anyone, but I agree with his point that we really have to deal with both the personal and the public when we talk about sin. It is true that these young women will have some decisions to make about how to view what happened to them. The best case scenario is that they will forgive their captors and abusers and keep their hearts clear. But even if they do that, they will be drawn into the public process of testifying against those men who society will no doubt call to account — by sending them to jail. Jails are wonderful places to meet Jesus. I pray those men will meet Him there.

  22. oneg2dblu says:

    Wow is this topic moving along at a rapidly varied pace,
    from re-defining of John 8:34 from slavery to addiction, who knew the Lord used the wrong word for modern thinking man?
    According to some here we are born addicted to those things we have not yet even tasted. There’s a stretch if I’ve ever heard one.
    Secondly, if a message is not given in love, or what we perceive as given in love, then it is for hurt, retaliation, malice and evil. You forgot that if your answer does not come back in a timely fashion, it is received as disingenuous, unmerited, dishonest and probably filled with lies.
    Not much room for growth there either!
    I wonder which of those words; properly fit the Wrath of God that has already taken place upon humanity, and producing for multitudes and generations, His great use of a hard message against evil… Oh Yeah, it was out of Love, that God chose to employ His Wrath upon man.
    Even though it was probably received as hurt, retaliation, malice, and evil by those it was given to.

    So, now we are saying that even justice applied to evil equally and to all is not of our choosing either, for we want others to also not be forgiven as well, because their crimes are worse than ours?

    Wow!

    Too bad the Word of God says otherwise.

    We can not change the Law of Reaping and Sowing,
    to our liking either.

    Galatians 6:7, 8, 9 “Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit from that Spirit, will reap eternal life. Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.”
    “If we do not give up… is part of the fullness of the Law of Reaping and Sowing.”
    (accept for those who are saved?)
    Sorry, that is not part of this Law, because how we are living today, (our sowing) is critical to where we will end up. (our reaping) lest we repent of our sins and accept that we have our part in forgiveness. IMHO
    Gary

  23. SFDBWV says:

    Gary take a deep breath and calm down, I am not changing what Jesus said or trying to redefine it. Before His sacrifice on the cross all men were under slavery to sin. Once He paid the price to God for mans sin all of past present and future mankind was set free from the slavery of sin. “Once and for all.”

    A slave has no choice in their circumstance; they are a slave chained to their position.

    As a free man they then have the choice of what they do with their freedom.

    I used and use the term addiction to explain how powerful that yearning is in men to continue in their sin.

    I hope I have cleared up any misunderstanding you may have taken by what I have said.

    As for the remainder of what you’ve said, I am lost, I am sorry I have no understanding how it applies to what we are talking about or if it is in contention to what I may have said.

    Steve

  24. remarutho says:

    Good Morning All —

    Succinctly (re)stated: Retributive civil or criminal justice — that being the sentence, fine or both — does not touch, or correct the depraved soul. Only the blood of the Lamb of God can sponge it clean.

    Agree with you, Kingdomkid, that a Crossings pod — or a Christian prison fellowship — is a wonderful way to encounter the risen Christ. Believing over here that the guilty sadists will receive consequences for their crimes. The consequences applied by society will not transform them, in my opinion. No one can say, “I would never do what they have done.” We are all foul sinners until we are plunged into the fountain of Christ’s forgiveness…

    Yours,
    Maru

  25. swwagner says:

    To SFDBWV:

    “Theologically speaking the only difference between a criminal and a non criminal is the act of carrying out the sin that has already been considered in the heart of a non criminal by the criminal.”

    I agree with the assessment you made in the quote above. It was quite a shock to me about 45 years ago when I realized that “wishing someone were dead” in my mind and heart, was the same as if I had really done the act. In light of all that has gone through my mind in my life, I am a thief, murderer, adulterer, etc. I am thankful to God that I never acted on my impulses or thoughts in the physical realm…but I am guilty just the same. Forgiveness and Mercy from the Lord is all I can cling too…Only His Righteousness and Blood can cover my sins!

  26. swwagner says:

    Being a victim of abuse myself, It is a long road to healing. There are physical, mental, & emotional scars that have changed your personality and health. Some of those will never be regained in this life even though they improve when the abuse stops…or when you learn how to deal with the abuse that doesn’t stop.

    It is hard to know that you were a more balanced and healthy person before the trauma and will never be that person again. It is not all bad, the destroying of self leads to “an abandonment to God”. The pain, self loathing, and bitterness have to come out and run their course…then Jesus comes softly and gently to show you His own scars. He understands. He weeps for us. He isn’t afraid of our anger and strong emotions. He comes to us in the storm.

  27. oneg2dblu says:

    Steve, I took a deep breath, thanks.
    I thought we were saved from the guilt of sin that was forgiven us when we made our first confession, asking God to forgive us our sins, because they had clearly happened and their results to the world around us and upon us were already a past event, but the guilt was never released, nor the trespass.
    Clearly if we keep on sinning, and live just as the rest of the unchanged world, then we are still slaves to that which enslaved us, because we can not let go of it and serve both the Spirit and the flesh, unless scripture got that wrong.
    I do get your point, but true repentance is a turning away from where one had once walked in sin, not a continuation, or a returning to it.

    Have I been misled?

    So, to me, the Law of Reaping and Sowing to Sin, remains as long as we remain enslaved to it,
    just as the Law of Reaping and Sowing to righteousness remains through our making godly right choices.
    Would you agree? Gary

  28. poohpity says:

    swwagner, I am also a victim of abuse from parents, a spouse and an unknown assailant from a rape so I can empathize with those struggles. I agree the Lord has no problem with our very strong emotions as we share it all with Him. Every little feeling we have and as they come up throughout the rest of our lives. Thank you for sharing. Sincerely Deb

  29. AmazedbyHis grace says:

    Pooh and Sm, I see that we have tragedies in common but there’s something you need to know. When you are “Claiming you are a victim” you are putting the chains on again. Through Christ you can step away and you can rise in Christ which drops satan’s stronghold bringing complete freedom from the pain incurred. (I don’t capitalize satan.) I said “can” not “will” because it takes your step step into Christ and have it remain active, then you will rise above as His interactive Spirit fills and heals. Sometimes this takes a lot of Spiritual awareness and readiness to place Truth and Promises where satan throws negative and gets you to cast your eyes inward. Listen to truths as you read God’s word. Studying helps you listen and you have to keep this up. We easily fall back into the pit and though we know the way out, we need to be reminded that we must turn and take that step to Him again.

  30. poohpity says:

    As sswagner said I have also worked through those situations a very long time ago with forgiveness that is how I know it is a process. I am able to look back now over those times with brand new eyes and heart not allowing them to hold me captive to anger, hatred and malice with the false belief that it was my fault because of the forgiveness Christ showed me I also can it give it away.

  31. oneg2dblu says:

    Steve… and anyone else posting here, I pose this question for my personal growth in the Lord, not to condemn others or convict any person reading this, but only to edify.
    If we are released from sin, all sin, past, present, and future sin as Steve quoted and we are being taught today, which is a message that Paul obviously lacked in his teachings about how those who “if they were to practice certain sins” they will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven when he was clearly speaking to the churches and the saints he knew, or those who were already saved, as he was warning them all about any past, current, and possible future eternal life threatening behaviors.
    Did he just waste his own words, or was he directed by a higher power who’s words are never void?

    I would really like someone here to share with me that biblical reference, or verses for those already forgiven, but clearly uncommitted sins, which we can not ask to be forgiven of, or truly repent from, until they are committed, can we?
    Can we also apply this ultimate all encompassing forgiveness of sin principle to any and all unrepentented, unconfessed, and not yet practiced sin, and render Paul’s teachings as really void and useless for those churched he was writing to?

    Why would God allow such a supposedly useless teaching for the already forgiven to be in His Word?

    Or, have I been misled about who Paul directed his teachings to, those that were found in his letters directed to the churches?

    As we all want to believe today that we are no longer under any of the old biblical laws about sin, which could help correct all our current unrighteous behaviors, but now being that we are already eternally righteous and free from sin and the law anyhow, according to our modern thinking, we don’t really need any of Paul’s useless teachings, do we?
    What would you say is the reason why any laws are made in the first place, if not to change our past, present, and future wrong behavior?

    Perhaps that is why we are under the leading of the Holy Spirit today, or the new law, which can not lead us to go against any of the Laws of God, even those we are no longer under, because it is a truly god-directed holy and righteous spirit that speaks as it still convicts us of our already forgiven sin today, which the law used to do before it was supposedly abolished or dissolved by this new freedom from sins that we now live in, or are still addicted to.

    Please feel free to reply, I want to learn more about this new and certainly “addictive freedom’ that currently allows us to continue living in our sin without condemnation, but yet is always under conviction.

    The Holy Spirit within me is definitly promoting to avoid any sin that Paul taught about, that would keep those practising those unrighteous behaviors from entering the Kingdom of Heaven.
    That Spirit says, they were taught for a reason, and repenting from them still exists for a reason.
    Have I been misled?
    Gary

  32. foreverblessed says:

    Hello Gary, I guess I answered your question in the other topic, law and grace.

  33. foreverblessed says:

    Amazedby grace, you must have been inspired and motivated by the teachings of Joyce Meyer, at the moment I a reading her book, battle of the mind. Being in a state of negative thinking and changing that to positive thinking with studying all the versed of the bible, that say that we are a new creature in Christ, yes, very true

Leave a Comment

You must be logged in to post a comment.