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The News We Hear

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2015 ArtPrize Exhibit

In the last post I mentioned a couple of books that take up the question of why the best news the world has ever heard is so often heard as bad news.

In Simply Good News, author N.T. Wright considers some important questions like— Why would we refer to information that’s been around for thousands of years as “news” and— why would we want to call it good news if the Gospel of Christ amounts to such bad news for the great majority of the world’s population.

Wright opens the door to talking about a number of difficult questions by reminding his readers that the Greek word for Gospel was used in the first century for news regarding the outcome of a military battle. For example, it was “gospel” for many first century Roman citizens to hear from the battlefront that Octavian, the adopted son of Julius Caesar, had brought to an end 13 years of civil war by defeating Mark Antony. (The author indicates this is not an unrelated example since Octavian was eventually named Augustus Caesar, the first Roman Emperor—under whose reign Jesus was born).

So— when the “gospel” went out that Jesus of Nazareth had risen from the dead after being executed for claiming to be the king of the Jews, some were happy and others weren’t.

However it was heard, the news deserved its headlines. The Gospel being announced by Jesus’ followers was, first and foremost, good news about an infinitely powerful King who was willing to go to war against everything that was ruining us, and our world—by taking on himself the angry, violent, natural consequences of our rebellion.  It was news about a Son who died claimed to be revealing the heart of his Father in heaven.

And what about his enemies? Even before his crucifixion, Jesus had urged his followers to do more than love one another. And from his cross, he expressed the same heart when he said of those who hated him enough to demand his death, “Father, forgive them. They don’t know what they are doing.”

Any resistance therefore to this good news didn’t/and doesn’t need to be born out of a fear that the risen King would come with self-centered vengeance on those who had sided with his enemies. The only real reason for fear would be that those who had invested heavily in themselves at the expense of others— would have to decide to continue in rebellion, or be forgiven and occupied with the Spirit of a new kind of kingdom.

The King of this kingdom wasn’t and won’t be enthroned on the outcome of an election (except on the throne of our own hearts). Neither has he ever been loved by everyone— or any of us, all of the time. But as author NT Wright says, the real good news— is far better than the unasked for advice his people often try to give others, and even one another, in the name of “the Gospel”.

Note: The “burnt wood” exhibit from ArtPrize 2015 reminded me of the way C.S. Lewis portrayed Aslan.


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77 Responses to “The News We Hear”

  1. SFDBWV says:

    Mart I have to tell you I am smiling at today’s subject not so much because of the seriousness of it but because of the difficulty in getting through it. If I drank (and I don’t) I would have to go have a snort and watch a sitcom to untangle my mind.

    Many times our subjects look more like a book report and unless I have read the same book it is difficult for me to share thoughts, for that I do apologize.

    As for the word “Gospel” as given in Greek meaning “The good news”, for me all of my life as a Christian and believer in Jesus of Nazareth to be the promised Messiah as given in the Hebrew texts. The good news is that He has finally come.

    The Romans coined the term “barbaric” as meaning any peoples who did not speak Greek or Latin.

    So from one barbarian to others the arrival of Jesus was good news then and remains good news to all who need to know their sins are forgiven, covered and that mankind can again have a relationship with our creator.

    Because each generation has to prove everything over again, it will remain “good news” to those who have never understood what Jesus has done for us all.

    Sorry I don’t see any bad news in this revelation.

    26 degrees under clear skies this morning.

    Steve

  2. poohpity says:

    Not understanding the outcome or the reason it certainly does sound like bad news for someone to have their flesh ripped open to the point of being unrecognizable as human flesh and then suffering through the crucifixion for those who will hate you and even call you names.

    Also bad news for those who thought they were done with Jesus after laying Him in the grave only to find Him gone, yep to them, in that time, it certainly was bad news. Those same people thought that would be the end of it only to find it was just the beginning of the Jesus movement something they thought they had done away with. Bad news for them but very good news for those who believed then and for us now.

  3. jeff1 says:

    Why is it that I always see the gospel has good news for the less powerful in society. It seems to be human nature that when people gain power they believe it is given to them by God to persecute people who do not agree with their beliefs. Jesus was unique and now I see why, He did what man cannot do accept people for what they are and by example of His own life draw them to Him for all the right reasons. Leaders like Jesus are rare today because societies method of producing leaders does not align with God’s way. Jesus to-day is still the good news for the most vulnerable in society for the faces of men change from one generation to the next but their ignorance of the truth of the gospel does not.

    Religions have damaged God’s character and confused the unlearned into believing God wants to Lord it over people. In effect they have caused the unlearned to fear God for being sinners instead of trusting God to save them from sin.

    The next generation are turning to science for answers because mankind has failed to grasp the good news of the gospel because of false teaching.

    While religions play the blame game as to whom as understood what about God people are perishing for the truth of the gospel.

    What we need is to get back to basics, Christ is the fulfilment of the gospel, there is no other when religions put that first and there beliefs second then maybe this world will take God seriously.

  4. remarutho says:

    Good Morning BTA Friends —

    Have not read NT Wright’s book, Simply Good News, but I did just this morning read the Book of Amos (preparing for Sunday school class):

    “The Lord roars from Zion and from Jerusalem
    He utters His voice;
    And the shepherds’ pasture grounds mourn,
    And the Summit of Carmel dries up.” Amos 1:2

    Amos is the prophet who predicted a famine:

    “Behold, days are coming,” declares the Lord God,
    “When I will send a famine on the land,
    Not a famine for bread or a thirst for water,
    But rather for hearing the words of the Lord.
    “People will stagger from sea to sea
    And from the north even to the east;
    They will go to and fro to seek the word of the Lord,
    But they will not find it.
    “In that day the beautiful virgins
    And the young men will faint from thirst.
    “As for those who swear by the guilt of Samaria,
    Who say, ‘As your god lives, O Dan,’
    And, ‘As the way of Beersheba lives,’
    They will fall and not rise again.” Amos 8:11-14

    There will be some who will refuse the Bread of Life — and will starve spiritually — even while the news we hear is that we have “made ourselves” more prosperous, more advanced and more knowledgeable than ever as the human race.

    Grace and Peace,
    Maru

  5. joycemb says:

    Good day all,

    I’ve read and listened to Wright on Youtube and he’s definitely a stoic Brit which does make him hard to understand, I think, being an overly psychoanalyzed American who has to wade through myriad feelings to get to the plain truth sometimes. He does a magnificent job of explaining the NT teachings. In fact I just purchased the Kingdom New Testament he wrote and am enjoying very much.
    I think it’s kind of ironic that he’s Church of England, once a bishop even, who is catching the attention of evangelicals of American, who’s ancestry fled to this land to escape the Church of England to set up their own way to worship. Religious liberty is what we here came from, yet, the liberty we gained has more to do with knowing the ‘thou shalt nots’, than the ‘loving one-another’s’ of grace.

  6. jeff1 says:

    Joyce says, Religious liberty is what we here came from, yet, the liberty we gained has more to do with knowing the ‘thou shalt nots’, than the ‘loving one-another’s’ of grace.

    It’s more than ironic, God has purpose in it. Your liberty is God given not man driven, you must keep focused on where your grace comes from.

  7. joycemb says:

    Thank you Viv! Your battle-weary wisdom is quite evident. Blessings, Joyce

  8. saled says:

    The Good News seemed like bad news to me when, as a child, I heard that unless you believed in Jesus and asked for forgiveness of sins you were headed for hell. Oh, I wasn’t sure that I believed in Jesus; afterall, I was just beginning to doubt Santa Claus. But it wasn’t my own soul that I worried about; it was those of my parents. My mother’s family built and ran the church that was within walking distance of our home, but my parents did not attend. They were not the only people in our small, Maine town who did not belong to the church, but I felt like a social outcast because I could not say that they were ‘saved’. So for me, the Good news was actually bad new; Heaven meant nothing to me if they were not there.

    I like this idea that the real Good News is far better than the unasked for advice that we try to give others, as Mart states in his closing. There is hope, God is far bigger than the box that any denomination has him in. I love the Lion wood burning. I love C.S Lewis and his character Aslan also. Someone in the Narnia series asks if Aslan is safe. The reply is that He is not safe, but He is good. We can trust him.

  9. street says:

    thinking Jesus came to give us freedom, not the bondage of religion. freedom from the tyranny of sin. truly good news. really bad news to the status quo.

    thinking further about the victors who celebrated and shared stories of conquest. it’s hard to speak differently when so much spoil and joy is evident. it would be very hard to dispute or claim inside info to the contrary.

  10. joycemb says:

    I think perceptions, being limited by our own experiences are just that, perceptions. I went through a phase where I blamed ‘religion’ for my bad experiences in the church. But I am recognizing that everyone sitting in a pew is there feeling good or not so good because of their perceptions. Who knows really whether we should blame religion or maybe we should just concentrate more on grace, yet I think we are afraid to allow the word to stretch far enough because of the constraints of religion and our own perceptions of just how much grace God should/would allow. I really think that as we make God in our own image rather than the other way around we limit Him.

    Earlier today as I was praying I said to God, “Who are you, really. When I look around my life seems to be a shamble. Do my perceptions of you even come close to who you really are? Why do some suffer little and some more than 12 good people could handle. I haven’t gotten a response, but trust that Whoever He really is heard my prayer and will let me know more, if He wants to. Or maybe as I let-go of some of my hard-won perceptions I will be open to learning more about Him. The only way I begin to have an understanding of His nature is by looking at Jesus. Jesus said whoever has seen him has seen the Father. That is the beginning, and the stories of my life either stand or fall on Him. Sounds simple, really, but why do we make it so hard? Probably why it’s called by some “The greatest story ever told”. Just thinking.

  11. street says:

    The Romans coined the term “barbaric” as meaning any peoples who did not speak Greek or Latin.

    was at a Bible study friday and they mentioned that there are over 6500 known languages. each is just as diverse and deep as the next. all given by God oh so long ago because of our disobedience. is anything too hard for God?

  12. jeff1 says:

    I have went my own way because I listened to men’s version of whom God is and not God Himself.

    That is the bad news but the good news is God knows me better than I know myself so He knew how I would fail Him.

    When I am in a gathering of people who believe in God it is easy to worship Him.

    In my head, I take myself outside my comfort zone, I pretend I am Peter and there is an angry crowd around me and I know if I speak in favour of Christ I will become a victim of their anger!

    It is in knowing what I am that I know I do not deserve
    Salvation but it is knowing who God is that I know I have received it!

    If you ask me to discern a follower of Christ today I would point you to missionaries, and humanitarians.

    I have more claim to believing the gospel than I have to living it.

    Am I saved for confessing with my mouth and believing in my heart that I am! The debate that will not go away!

    I do not believe so. Why are people who do not believe the good news very Christ like in their behaviour!

    A person’s behaviour says more about them than what they have to say or not say about God.

    The miraculous power of God saves us and how God deals with us as individuals will gain us reward, or loss, for while together we make up the Church of Christ, as individuals we are responsible for our behaviour towards not only those we like but those we do not like for we cannot cherry pick, Christ’s command love your enemies.

    I must confess I have failed to love my enemies but I do understand them better and live in hope that they will turn away from hatred and strife!

    I wish them no harm and entrust them to God whom knows them better than I do, and will apply justice not vengeance in His judgements of them.

    In getting to know God I am getting to trust Him, and not my own or anyone’s understanding, HOW BLESSED I AM!

  13. poohpity says:

    I was thinking about the paragraph that says, “Any resistance therefore to this good news didn’t/and doesn’t need to be born out of a fear that the risen King would come with self-centered vengeance on those who had sided with his enemies. The only real reason for fear would be that those who had invested heavily in themselves at the expense of others— would have to decide to continue in rebellion, or be forgiven and occupied with the Spirit of a new kind of kingdom.”

    Investing in myself at the expense of others as a rebellious act sadly I understand that. When I have to put others down to feel better about myself or blame others without taking personal responsibility for my responses/reactions to them it really does not matter which, I am not occupied with the forgiveness of the new life given to me. It to me is not about what others do within the church body but what I do. Am I making the church a better place? Am I doing more quality control of others or allowing the Spirit to work within me for self control and patience?

  14. foreverblessed says:

    The good news perceived as bad news:
    Years ago, when I had moved to a new area, I searched for a new church, and I went to the mainstream Protestant church in a neighboring town. They had a theme on Atonement. I thought that that would be interesting.
    But the evening took a turn I had never expected. It was said, that God is not a God who wants to see His Own Son tortured and killed. So this must not have happened, the Cross must have been symbolic.
    God does not require blood to forgive.
    That was the notion of the evening.

    So people look at God, and they say, how can a loving God want His Son to be killed, and the blood needed for forgiveness of sins?
    A loving God would just forgive.

    So the good news was perceived to these people as bad news.

    The only thing I could do, was to pray, intercessory prayer.

    For me personally I do believe that God does not want His Son to be killed, neither does He want that His blood is flowing. He does not WANT it, but because it is needed for our sins to be thrown in the sea, as far as east is from the west, that it was NEEDED that His blood was flowing for our cleansing.
    The Cross was needed, because our sins require them. Not because God could do it otherwise, just like they say, let God just forgive. If He could He would have done it.
    Even Jesus asked, Father, let this cup pass me.
    If God could have done that, He would have done that, but then we could not have been redeemed.

    Anyway, God waits, till a person comes to a point that they accept the state of their sins, and what they requires to be cleansed.
    I keep praying for them.

  15. jeff1 says:

    The truth is Pooh that our good intentions do not always end in god like behaviour. All too often I let the voice telling me I have every right to feel angry control me and fail God in the process. All around us are people who make us angry by their bad behaviour and it takes the work of God in me to react correctly and the truth is I often fail to deliver. Then when I do there is guilt to deal with for having failed so we do often feel like we have taken 1 step forward and a dozen steps backwards. I too often get stuck afraid to take a step because past failures make it difficult not in trusting God but trusting whether it is God I have heard or my own understanding which has caused me so much misery in the past. A quote from Mother Theresa – ‘I know God won’t give me anything I can’t handle – I just wish He didn’t trust me so much’.

  16. SFDBWV says:

    Several years ago we enjoyed watching “Who Wants to be a Millionaire?” with Regis Philbin. It was never as good after Regis left and the format changed.

    During one program there was a young man on who had graduated from Seminary, but had traveled to the East in order to learn more of Buddhism.

    Sadly this young fellow isn’t alone in his endless quest to fulfill the emptiness, or better said perhaps, the nagging questions of his unsettled spirit.

    It is almost as if the more we study the more doubt and questions arise.

    Paul met an intellectual brick wall when he told the “Thinkers” at Mars Hill that Jesus of Nazareth had returned from the dead. Yet they were open to learning about this new religion, until this one point was included in the telling of The Gospel”.

    If we stick to the very basics it may sound something like this; there “is” a Creator God; because of man’s rebellion against Him He became a man born of a Virgin and allowed Himself to be sacrificed in place of all of us. From past generations, that particular generation and future generations to come.

    To prove He was who He said He was He rose from the dead promising all of us who believed on Him would rise again as well.

    His sacrifice renews our relationship with Him and cleanses us of any and all sins, we are all forgiven.

    His name is Jesus of Nazareth.

    This is the good news or in Greek the Gospel and what we are to present to the world.

    We are not to present religion to the world; “that” is old news.

    Was 20 degrees this morning under clear skies.

    Steve

  17. jeff1 says:

    How many people follow religions in the world today? Most people learned about God through religion. I certainly did. I suppose that’s why I went so badly wrong listening to others preaching God through religion. It has been part of my journey to learn from those who claimed to know God best. Ignorance is bliss and when you do not know any other way you believe what you are told. I did not have the insight of my father, he could discern whom to listen to and whom not to. I now listen for the still small voice. I believe science is taking over from religions and that may be for the best for science will support God’s existence and put an end to the confusion surrounding God’s character for those who need convincing. I see myself as a product of my time and I am more than ready to leave it to the next generation to seek the unresolved questions from the scientific and technical world that is emerging and which I have little or no knowledge of.

  18. joycemb says:

    Well said Steve.

    Christ plus whatever destroys the Message. I’ve been reading about some of the current and well known teachings going around by so called ministers or prophets of Christ. Deception is far and wide with the help of tv, internet and radio. It takes the Spirit of God within to keep us from being deceived. Only the risen Christ could and did send the Holy Spirit to keep us from being deceived. We must always be listening to that still, small Voice that keeps us free from bondage and slavery even to deceiving spirits. Praying for all today for eyes to see and ears to hear the simple Gospel, and let God lead them into all truth.

  19. joycemb says:

    Hi Viv I guess we both were thinking along the same lines today.

  20. jeff1 says:

    We have a saying ‘Great minds think alike’ but in our case it is ‘Christ like minds think alike’.

    You’ll never walk alone

    When you walk through a storm,
    Hold your head up high,
    And don’t be afraid of the dark,
    At the end of a storm,
    There’s a golden sky,
    And a sweet silver song of a lark,
    Walk on through the wind,
    Walk on through the rain,
    Through your dreams be tossed and blown…
    Walk on! Walk on! With hope in your heart,
    And you’ll never walk alone…
    Walk on! Walk on! With hope in your heart,
    And you’ll never walk alone…
    You’ll never walk alone.

  21. joycemb says:

    Thanks for the encouragement Viv. It’s so easy to feel alone which has been a lifelong struggle for me. So thankful to have other believers to walk with.

  22. bubbles says:

    Wouldn’t it be only bad if the one hearing it didn’t understand, or didn’t accept what they have learned? Then the bad news would be they would reject what they have learned.

  23. SFDBWV says:

    There is a fellow I know who could be said to be a friend. He is several years younger than I and like so many people here I have known his family very well.

    He never seemed to be able to put his life together having worked away off and on over the years, suffering at least one disastrous marriage and always returning here as this place his anchor.

    He lives in a small cabin up out of town a few miles and has relied on a few friends for his survival.

    His “dad” died when he was rather young, but old enough to realize his mother was seeing other men while his dad was slowly dying. He found out later his older sister belonged to another man than his dad and though he loved his dad very much he was never certain that his dad was his father.

    It was I who told him when his mother died, he pretended to not care.

    Over the past several years he has worked for the town as a maintenance worker and we have grown closer as friends. Filled with hurt and the pains life can give he seemed to prefer a life of solitude, but I know better, he has always, like all of us, just wanted someone to love and be loved by.

    This summer he had little or no energy to work and though telling us he had lost weight, he has continued to swell up with fluid. He refused any advice or efforts to seek medical attention and yesterday he told a mutual friend he didn’t have the strength to even get up and leave his little cabin.

    His name is Kevin and I would ask any of you who feel led to pray for his salvation and for his own personal peace.

    What may this story have to do with the subject? Everything!

    Steve

  24. poohpity says:

    Yes it is news to be the brunt of small town gossip! I would probably live in seclusion too. Real friends do not share gossip with others in the form of prayer requests. How do you know he is not saved? I wonder how much damage is done to that poor man’s heart and life because of the news that others felt was worthy to share behind his back. I will pray that the small town people will find something better to do with their time than to carry the kind of news that harms and destroys people.

    Look at the gossip spread about Jesus; He was the devil, He was causing rebellion against the current system, He came to over throw the government, He was insane, He was incapable of saving Himself, He hangs around the worst sinners and the sick, etc.. All because the people did not spend intimate time with Him to get to know who He was and what he came for.

  25. jeff1 says:

    It is a burden of living in a small community everyone knows everyone’s business and tries to tell them how they should feel and lead their life. Why do some people never see that another’s person’s life is in God’s hands not their’s. The sad thing is that well meaning people often add salt to a person’s wound by saying the wrong thing rather than listening to the person and praying to God on their behalf without all in sundry getting involved and making the person feel even worse.

  26. joycemb says:

    Good morning here,
    I was thinking about Gospel and battle. We are in a battle with dark forces when we pray for one another. Jesus said “where 2 or more are gathered there will I be also”. Steve feel free to share by email any battles you are involved in as I consider myself a prayer warrior also.

    God is working out daily my plans for my move back up North, I love how intimately involved He is with each one of our lives. “Even into old age…” As the Psalmist said.

    All have a blessed day knowing The Lord is on your side.

  27. poohpity says:

    Do we need to share intimate details of a person’s life to pray for them? I believe God knows more about them than we will ever know so just lifting a person up in prayer seems to be quite enough since God is fully aware of their heart and their needs while we look more to the outside, the things we can see and what we think are their needs.

  28. street says:

    saw a video on facebook about a girl posting pics of herself online. there were many negative comments that were hurtful and totally uncalled for. then she started posting pictures of herself professionally made up. the hurtful and negative comments kept coming, but from the opposite side of the street. it was eye opening and heart opening. thinking people are reveling what is in their hearts. God looks at the heart. some hearts He does not pass by and you have to wonder why? the ones He remains with and sets His love on sure have much to be happy about. set your heart upon Jesus, look fully into His wonderful face and the world will grow strangely dim in the light of His glorious love. looking forward
    without poverty brokenness hunger and thirst there would be no need of God and no knowledge of love. Dad really knows what He is doing. oh to trust Him more and walk with Him like samual david and Jesus.

  29. SFDBWV says:

    For those of us who have actually read books and works of biographies or fiction there is a great deal of effort that goes into establishing the character of the people in the story.

    The past subject titled “Backstory” was all about establishing the background of us and why we behave in the way we do.

    Matthew wrecked his car on June 7, 1999 his mother and I didn’t leave the hospital until he was established in a rehabilitation hospital in July of 99. At this point she and I took turns being with him at the rehab hospital as each of us worked a schedule that allowed us to.

    He came home from the hospital on September 21, 1999, I took another leave of absence for two weeks in order to get him settled in at home. Again his mother and I took turn about in his care until October of 99 when Rita discovered she had cancer.

    I had to quit working in order to take care of them both, our incomes came to a halt, but our living expenses did not.

    The people in our little small town and surrounding communities held church dinners and took up donations even going so far as to establish a fund at the local bank in order to help us survive.

    We have done this for people in need for as long as I can remember.

    It is upsetting that some of you won’t see the difference between gossip and genuine concern for neighbors.

    Every detail I gave you concerning Kevin came from Kevin to me, not as a result of wagging tongues.

    It was my intention to give you all a little background to a hurting human being and ask for prayer for him.

    All I am going to say to you pooh is “The Lord rebuke you!”

    Steve

  30. poohpity says:

    Did you ask him if you could share his story with the many readers on this blog? It is an honor to have someone come to another and share their story I bet hopefully in confidence being a safe place to be open.

    One can give all the info and background about their self because it is sharing themselves but did any of us need to know his background to pray for him? That is called gossip. That rebuke is from you not the Lord. The Lord wants to protect those who are not here to speak for themselves. Steve you shared info about “his” mom, dad and sister on top of his story that really was nothing any of us needed to know. Do you honestly believe that honored or valued what he shared with you?

    I do not care what anyone else says that just ain’t cool at all.

  31. poohpity says:

    The very sad part is not understanding and others going along supporting what you did. Maybe saying something like, “my friend has experienced some really hard things in his life will you join me in praying for him”.

  32. jeff1 says:

    Living in a small village for most of my life I found what you said Steve that when tragedy happens the village pulls together and supports those involved.

    When we have difficulties that involve moral issues that brings another side of people to the forefront. My friend told me when her daughter got pregnant outside wedlock the comments made to her by some villagers where anything but pleasant.

    I often hear people comment on people with alcoholic problems and drug problems and they are anything but understanding towards them so I do see where Pooh is coming from.

    My doctor said to me when I was separating from my husband that it was good I was going to a bigger town for their would be less gossip to upset me. I think the downside to small communities that you must take the good with the bad or else it is best to live in the town/city if it is not for you.

  33. phpatato says:

    Steve

    Like Joyce, please send to me any requests for prayers whether for you and your family or friends of yours.

    As for Pooh….Mart she is at it once again!!!….it’s that time of month again. As usual and to set the clock by you Pooh, you have been so BS full of sweet praises for everything written on here but each day that pass, you start to slide. Your comments become a little more acidic until one day, we wake to find that you’ve become the nasty, ignorant unChristian-like monster that you so easily become and enjoy being. How dare you twist Steve’s prayer request into something evil. Evil is as evil does and the sad thing is it seems you are dragging an unsuspecting but willing blogger into the mire you dwell in. Don’t ever let me hear you ask for any more prayer requests. If you do, you are not only evil you will be an evil hypocrite. Shame on you!!!! And who do you think you are by giving Steve any advice? You of all people. My what gall people possess.

  34. jeff1 says:

    Street’s post 12.50pm 20 Oct –

    ‘Without poverty, brokenness, hunger and thirst, there would be no need of God and no knowledge of love’.

    It is why we should not intervene when others are going through trials, no matter what we think we know about a person there is secret places in us that only God can touch.

    God never wastes our suffering and we cannot take away another’s suffering because it is personal between God and them.

    When do we really listen to what God is saying without telling him we know better.

    God really does know us better than we know ourselves and that is the ‘Good News’ we all need whether we believe it or not!

  35. jeff1 says:

    The reality of life is that often ‘someone else’s good news’ is ‘someone else’s bad news’. It is God who directs our paths, and if we are trusting Him then acceptance of what He brings be it either news is proof that we have faith in Him.

    We dishonour God when we tell another person what God is doing in their life (Job’s friends tried.) We have no idea what God is doing in their life nor they ours.

    Allow the miraculous work of God no matter what pain and suffering you have to go through for by doing so you will get to know God in a way you never thought possible.

    It is God who knows what we need not people, I spent my life looking to people and found they knew no better than I did.

    People will cause you more unnecessary pain by offering platitudes that do not make you feel any better while God will give you the peace and understanding that only He can.

  36. cbrown says:

    The Father knows what He is doing but sometimes when reading the posts I get confused. Street would you explain what you meant in your post 10/20:1150PM. Steve I will pray for Kevin also. Joyce I am praying that God’s Holy Spirit will go before you when you move and prepare the way. That he will give you the words to share and that you will be a blessing to many.But I already know you will.

  37. street says:

    cbrown thinking about how to respond to confusion. i thought of a few replies but this is the one i think fits.
    it’s the difference between Father and Dad. they mean the same thing. yet i never called my paternal dad, father. always called him dad or daddy, when i was way younger. to me father was a legal title and true, but dad conveyed his love and acceptance. true he acted as a father when needed and i am thankful, but he never stopped being my dad. in a way love drives out confusion and establishes soundness.

  38. joycemb says:

    Good morning here in central Minnesota,

    My move is moving along, by God’s grace and direction. Thank you all for prayers and Chris for your especially encouraging words. Encouragement is hard to come by some days….

    Noticing large flocks of birds (starlings maybe) heading NORTH the past two days. North! Guess I am moving in the right direction, ha ha. Haven’t seen any geese going south yet, which is unusual. Temps in lower 60’s this week but all leaves are down now. The winter is a time of shutting down. Down time gives everything/body a chance to focus on God, learn from and enjoy His presence while He reminds us that all is well, really.

    Praying that all here who were upset and offended yesterday will be at peace knowing that God’s got this! Even though there is a war going on in the flesh and the spirit there is peace in Christ also, now and forevermore.

    blessings, Joyce

  39. poohpity says:

    Thank you Pat for sharing how you see me but I will go on how God sees me, you and all others.

    I am beautiful, worthwhile, important, special, unique, wonderful, talented and irreplaceable to Him.

    FYI, I was not putting Steve down in any way just saying that I did not need to know the history of Kevin to pray for him and that often times we can use telling a person’s backstory as a cover for gossip in the form of a prayer request.

  40. jeff1 says:

    Good to hear it Joyce as God takes you further on your journey and you meet new people.

    How many times in the day do I upset people yet still love them, the tongue, if I had a £1 for every time I lashed out with it then I would be a rich woman today.

    I have found in my lifetime that in general women are much quicker to lash out with it than men. So one up to you Gentlemen!

  41. joycemb says:

    Hi Viv, actually I am returning to people I have known for a long time, which makes the move that much sweeter!

    I found Discover the Word very good as it speaks to human emotions we all struggle with.

    Yes Viv women do tend to open our mouths before thinking. I agree men are better at this. Probably why we need them in our lives to balance out our perspectives! And for procreation, of course! God bless you guys all!

  42. remarutho says:

    Good Morning BTA —

    Yowza! We have covered a lot of terrain since I checked in last. Prayers going up for Keven in your small town, Steve — and for your move, Joyce, to a new place. May the Lord God bring the transformation we hope for!

    The news we hear, as you said, Mart is:

    “…far better than the unasked for advice his people often try to give others, and even one another, in the name of ‘the Gospel’”.

    My experience has been that the best effort I might put forth toward the improvement of somebody else is swept away when the blessed Holy Spirit swoops into the situation and moves mountains.

    Joy all day,
    Maru

  43. street says:

    cbrown thinking about how to respond to confusion.
    thinking about taking hits from all sides. when a person becomes a christian i think the hits from all sides increase. you still get the hits from the world. you just have to differentiate the difference. when you think about it it doesn’t matter where the hit comes from as long as it is fielded correctly. that is one of the most amazing things about Jesus is when He is talking to people and dealing with where they are at. if it doesn’t take your breath away, you missed the depth and seriousness of the conversation.

  44. cbrown says:

    Street’s post 12.50pm 20 Oct –

    ‘Without poverty, brokenness, hunger and thirst, there would be no need of God and no knowledge of love’.

    It is why we should not intervene when others are going through trials, no matter what we think we know about a person there is secret places in us that only God can touch.
    Street, you made the above comment and Viv responded. That thread is what i need a clarification on.

  45. joycemb says:

    “There is a theological teaching going around Christendom that says it is possible for one to accept Jesus as Savior without also recognizing Him and accepting Him as Lord; that it is possible to believe in Jesus without repenting of sin and yielding to His authority. To be sure, many of those who teach such a message do so out of a passion to keep the grace of God free of human effort and human works. But in reacting to one false teaching, I believe they have ridden the pendulum from one extreme to embrace another. As a result, they have abandoned such concepts of repentance and obedience and submission from the message of the gospel.” John Stevenson

    This explains a LOT about some of the confusing messages that occur on this blog.

  46. street says:

    Luke 20:18

    Luke 8: 4-15

  47. cbrown says:

    Hebrews 11:6 ‘And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.” Joyce gave an explanation of Luke 8;4-15 that he was giving the parable to Jews before His Ascension. Finally, he commands “us” to go to those in need.

  48. joycemb says:

    True, but on the other hand we can’t change another’s mind, only God can do that. Good night all.

  49. jeff1 says:

    God does not put that responsibility on us to change another’s mind, in our wisdom we try to do that. He asks us to be servants, feed His sheep, we have the easy part but many today are better at playing God than obeying God.

    Keep your faith simple was the best advice ever given to me by man, for knowledge of God for me has caused confusion as to what God does expect from me.

    By listening to man with all their different theology I took my eyes of God, but the truth about God is better than man can ever know, and it is coming to God when you are spiritually dead that awakens the truth about who God really is.

    It is in knowing that makes you realize what a hypocrite I have been and the knowledge of that humbles you to want to be the person God created you to be.

    God had to take me to the valley of humiliation in order for me to understand Him.

    I do not believe He takes us all on the same journey for while we are collectively the body of Christ, we are individuals and the same shoe size does not fit all.

    My weakness is stubbornness, my strength is listening, God has to remove from our Character, traits we have acquired that are not from Him in order to make us of any use to Him.

    Be assured that whatever you come through in this life will prepare you for the next for it is God and not man who directs your path.

    I am saved by the miraculous work of God not by faith or works. It is a heart of gratitude that makes me want to be of use to God and it is a heart that knows it that can be used by God.

    God is always there to pick up the pieces of your life and human nature being what it is He has to bring us to rock bottom before we see that need.

  50. remarutho says:

    Good Morning BTA —

    Mart, the listening versus hearing aspect of our topic is emerging in the conversation — one way or another. You wrote:

    “However it was heard, the news deserved its headlines. The Gospel being announced by Jesus’ followers was, first and foremost, good news about an infinitely powerful King who was willing to go to war against everything that was ruining us, and our world—by taking on himself the angry, violent, natural consequences of our rebellion. It was news about a Son who died claimed to be revealing the heart of his Father in heaven.”

    Jesus’ parable about how this “news” is being shared ends up comparing information to the light of a lamp:

    “Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed; but he puts it on a lampstand, so that those who come in may see the light.

    “For nothing is hidden that will not become evident, nor anything secret that will not be known and come to light.

    “So take care how you listen; for whoever has, to him more shall be given; and whoever does not have, even what he thinks he has shall be taken away from him.”

    Luke 8:16-18

    Everything hinges upon what a person thinks (s)he has heard. Jesus calls each one to discernment in listening, so that the light of His story increases and does not diminish, it seems to me.

    Blessings,
    Maru

  51. poohpity says:

    N.T. Wright reminded his readers, “that the Greek word for Gospel was used in the first century for news regarding the outcome of a military battle.” When one thinks about it that is exactly what happens in our lives with an ongoing battle against what the world teaches and what God teaches so it seems to be a war waged against our minds, body, heart and souls but the “Good News” is that that military battle has been won. So how we live that out seems to be so dependent in who and what we believe.

    We could make the choice in our lives to constantly battle against others and even ourselves or trust in the One who has won that battle and realize it is not against other human beings (flesh and blood) but against spiritual forces that just so enjoy taking over our minds, hearts and souls to take us from the higher ground to the trenches again in a state of war.

    Fighting against evil, hatred and anger which the world relishes in that and takes along revenge, unforgiveness, destruction rather than in peace, patience, kindness, gentleness which more often than not people think those are a sign of weakness or cowardliness rather than the strength found on/in depending on the Lord. So what kind of news do we want to cling to?

  52. poohpity says:

    It seems every piece of Spiritual armor we have been given are the very things that protect us and the one weapon we have is to be used within our own minds to fight against deception and the influx of the enemies weapons. Then we realize that as we stand all we have to do is call upon His name because He has already won the battle and it belongs to Him because He is the only one who can win it. Now that is some very “Good News”.

  53. foreverblessed says:

    Aboutwaht Joyce wrote on October 21, 6.50 pm
    I have also something to bring in, it is from God at eventide, October 20

    “Force

    My Kingdom must be won by force, that is, by effort. How can you reconcile this with My free gift of Salvation?

    My gift is free truly, and is not the reward of any merit on the part of Man. But just as God and mammon cannot both be given the overlordship in any one life, so My Kingdom, where I rule as King, cannot be inhabited by one in whom self reigns.

    Therefore the violence is that of discipline and self-conquest, together with the intensity of longing for My Kingdom and tireless effort to know and do My Will.”

    We often have discussion here, but I do not think that any one of us, who contributes on this blog, believes the easy way out, as John Stevenson describes.

    So, in a way, if you have that message
    –that only belief in Jesus without obeying His call to follow Him, is a risky way–
    tell it to the people who need to hear that message, I do not think that this blog is the platform to do so.

  54. joycemb says:

    forever thanks for your input. My perceptions of communications here are different than yours. Have a blessed day!

  55. foreverblessed says:

    Steve, I am praying for Kevin! Thanks for sharing.
    I hope we would do this more, a praying group.
    And I am also praying for Pooh! May God bless you many fold, may His Spirit of Peace be over you, and His Spirit of Love filling all the deep parts of your soul and mind.
    I pray that for all of you.
    That we may be a peaceful and prayerful christian blog.

  56. foreverblessed says:

    Joy, I did not mean your comment, you do this only once. But in the case you would do that every other day, then it would be your message to the blog. and as I perceive your input it isn’t. You are very encouraging and uplifting. So be blessed and stay that way.

  57. jeff1 says:

    God knows best, whom He chooses as warriors and whom He chooses as peace makers, we have varied skills that God can use accordingly, I just want to be of use, because I struggle with feelings of worthlessness and have doubts as to whether I can be of any purpose to Him.

  58. SFDBWV says:

    Viv yours and Joyce’s reference to the word “warrior” reminded me of another story in my life I will share.

    When Matthew was in the hospital in a coma and in intensive care, I my wife and other family members and friends lived in a little cubbyhole at the end of the hallway leading into the IC unit. So we were right aside the door and telephone. They would not let us stay in the room with our loved one very long and we would have to ask permission from the nurse in order to go in.

    In the next cubbyhole was a young mother whose 16 year old son was in a similar condition as Matt.

    The neurosurgeons told her they were going to have to cut away some of his brain in order to get the swelling to go down, but that it was a part of his brain he didn’t need anyway.

    Though you could tell she was a victim of her own circumstances, there were several women from her area that were solid prayer warriors and stayed with her night and day. When told she couldn’t go back to visit her son just after being told about their decision to cut away some of his brain these women stormed through the swinging doors with their bibles tucked up under their chests with the determination to stare down the devil.

    I will never forget their straight ahead stare as they went through those doors daring anyone to try and stop them.

    No one did.

    We also had plenty of prayer warriors the near month we spent in that awful place including two visitations from angels.

    There are a lot of prayers that go on in such places and always by people God puts there to help comfort and console.

    Thanks you both for the memory.

    Steve

  59. joycemb says:

    Steve that’s a powerful memory!

    Vivien just for you, and for me too:

    I Cor. 1:26 “Remember, dear brothers and sisters, that few of you were wise in the world’s eyes or powerful or wealthy[a] when God called you. 27 Instead, God chose things the world considers foolish in order to shame those who think they are wise. And he chose things that are powerless to shame those who are powerful. 28 God chose things despised by the world,[b] things counted as nothing at all, and used them to bring to nothing what the world considers important. 29 As a result, no one can ever boast in the presence of God.

    30 God has united you with Christ Jesus. For our benefit God made him to be wisdom itself. Christ made us right with God; he made us pure and holy, and he freed us from sin.”

    The Joy of the Lord is your strength!
    Psalm 3:3
    But you, LORD, are a shield around me, my glory, the One who lifts my head high.

    Psalm 13:5
    But I trust in your unfailing love; my heart rejoices in your salvation.

    Psalm 16:9
    Therefore my heart is glad and my tongue rejoices; my body also will rest secure,

    Psalm 18:2
    The LORD is my rock, my fortress and my deliverer; my God is my rock, in whom I take refuge, my shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold.

  60. jeff1 says:

    Thank you Steve and Joyce need to keep reminding myself that He will not let go of me even when I am weak and confused He still watches over me. I am finding peace more and more when I focus on Him and not on myself. It is could to share struggles and know that He works for His purpose and that all is well.

  61. poohpity says:

    Thank you forever for your prayers they have been answered in so many ways. Praising God with you. It is a blessing to know someone has my back, again thank you. I also pray often for everyone on our blog as well. :-)

  62. poohpity says:

    One can live as if they are fighting the battle that has already been won which negated the Good News by living like nothing has taken place in our hearts, minds and souls. Living like we have been redeemed rather than in the world we have been freed from(bad news). This song says it so well.

    Seems like all I can see was the struggle
    Haunted by ghosts that lived in my past
    Bound up in shackles of all my failures
    Wondering how long is this gonna last
    Then You look at this prisoner and say to me “son
    stop fighting a fight that’s already been won”

    I am redeemed, You set me free
    So I’ll shake off theses heavy chains
    Wipe away every stain now I’m not who I used to be
    I am redeemed

    All my life I have been called unworthy
    Named by the voice of my shame and regret
    But when I hear You whisper, “Child lift up your head”
    I remember oh God, You’re not done with me yet

    I am redeemed, You set me free
    So I’ll shake off theses heavy chains
    Wipe away every stain now I’m not who I used to be
    I am redeemed

    I don’t have to be the old man inside of me
    Cause his day is long dead and gone
    I’ve got a new name, a new life I’m not the same
    And a hope that will carry me home

    I am redeemed, You set me free
    So I’ll shake off theses heavy chains
    Wipe away every stain now I’m not who I used to be
    I am redeemed

  63. jeff1 says:

    I believe that for each of us there is a different journey.

    I know people who can do what the song says and forget their troubles and live life like they do not have a care in the world.

    I am not one of them and it has not been my walk of faith.
    I have lived in the real world and was taught that living a life of faith will require me to trust God even though He slay me.

    How often have people told me it was the will of God in my life when they did not have a clue to what the will of God was in my life.

    Why do people insist they know better than God that I should not be suffering when it is God who knows best.

    Walking by faith to my mind requires me not to know what God will bring into my life, it may be blessings but it may be suffering but God knows best.

    People want to know what God is doing in their life, yet they say they walk by faith!

    It is faith that pleases God not constantly asking Him what He is doing in ones life!

    Accept that whatever He brings you through it is to bring YOU closer to Him and it is God alone who knows best. Do not listen to people who tell you it is God’s will for it is them making assumptions from their perspective, trust the one who made you and knows you intimately.

    Think of you buy a faulty gadget from a shop, you take it back to the retailer because that is where you purchased it from but the retailer has to return it to the manufacturer to identify the fault.

    I am faulty by inheritance, and only God can identify by default, let Him do whatever it takes to make you what He always intended you to be.

  64. poohpity says:

    I did not understand that song to say forget your troubles nor did those who were going through them in the bible they all seem to admit to the struggles but rather than that being our focus, focus on the One who can help us sees things in a different light knowing we are not alone and can overcome with His help. Laying aside the things that bind us to detrimental thinking and looking at things with a different mind set.

    Not changing who one is but how one thinks. If I really think about it getting rid of the old way of thinking allows me to be me for the first time in my life. Not who others say I am but who God says I am, His child, a child of the King.

  65. poohpity says:

    I am in a play called “To Kill A Mockingbird” which a couple of the main themes are not judging other people without first considering what they are going through or as Harper Lee puts walking in their skin. The other point I found interesting was the Court Judge saying to the spectators who are watching a case about a black man being accused of something he did not do but due to the immense prejudices in that society and time would convict him just because of skin color. The Judge told the spectators if they wanted to protect the woman and children from listening to this case they may want to leave then he said, “You may feel there is something here to be learned or you may not want to face this problem” “People generally see what they are looking for and hear what they listen for.” “And they have the right to consider whatever decision is best” for them selves and their family.

    Although for me it is not best to think as I once did before I was saved that does not mean that I do not but now I have another option to chose from.

  66. poohpity says:

    Jesus said, “There was a lot of grumbling about him among the crowds. Some argued, “He’s a good man,” but others said, “He’s nothing but a fraud who deceives the people.” 13 But no one had the courage to speak favorably about him in public, for they were afraid of getting in trouble with the Jewish leaders.” Chapters 7+8 of John shows those who were heavily invested in their selves seeing what they wanted to see and hearing what they wanted to hear.

  67. poohpity says:

    Ooops that should have been John said,

  68. jeff1 says:

    That is the truth Pooh, people believe what they want and do not go there if they feel they cannot cope. Others are very realistic about the world they live in and face it head on.

    The people who make me most angry are those with expectations of others yet they themselves will not go there. I was very disappointed in a very good friend of mine when she said to me it was the will of God my son should join the army.
    One day in her car with her son he disclosed to me how he too would have liked to join the army and with angry in his voice also told me how his mother had tore up his application form and would not let him join. I had shared everything about my reservations about my son but she had never told me of her son and was rather dumbstruck when he shared it with me.

    She makes no secret of the fact that she believes war has to be but as long as it is someone else’s son, she never stops to think that I am that someone.

    I value our friendship that has lasted since primary school but when she brings up this subject I feel very upset at how she never gets how I must feel that she sees my son as dispensable in the war effort but not hers.

    I have managed to feel less upset by understanding that she does not know how I feel because she is not in my shoes.
    By doing that I can forgive her for her neglect of thoughtlessness towards me when she goes on about how no one in her family will me in the military.

    Sometimes the people hardest to love are often those closest to us but I must always remember that I too cause upset to others when I speak before I think.

    The strange thing about life is that I am always learning, age does not really bring wisdom,for I often find my wisdom challenged. In many ways my children are wiser than I am and I often learn more from the younger generation than from my own generation. God continues to work in them whether they see it or not.

  69. joycemb says:

    Mart you said: “Any resistance therefore to this good news didn’t/and doesn’t need to be born out of a fear that the risen King would come with self-centered vengeance on those who had sided with his enemies. The only real reason for fear would be that those who had invested heavily in themselves at the expense of others— would have to decide to continue in rebellion, or be forgiven and occupied with the Spirit of a new kind of kingdom”.

    Yesterday morning my friend called frantic saying she needed me to come asap as she was afraid her son was slipping away! I’d gotten a lot of packing and loading up my suv done then called to say I could be on the road this am. She then said she was fearful of her son (she takes care of her 42 year old son with TBI and Lupus and is deteriorating fast but has violent mood swings that cause her great fear) and that I shouldn’t come yet. I told her that God’s plans will not be thwarted by emotions; that His plans will succeed no matter what emotions we have to deal with, whether ours or others. Also I am selling off most of my furniture and still looking for a home for my cat so I really should stay around here as long as I can until the 3rd anyway. (she said please share this and ask for prayer, BTW.) Her son is very fearful, he rejects the gospel message, and this statement Mart explains why he lashes out so at his Godly mother who loves and cares for him and takes care of all his needs; drs, pills, insurance, cooking, shopping everything. It is becoming too much for her (she’s 69) which is why I am moving in with her for a bit until an apt opens up to help her with some of those things. On top of this her beloved older sister died last week, one who was very heavily involved with the Salvation Army all her life as was their mother. Please pray for them, thank you!

  70. poohpity says:

    Wow that is quite a change in one day from wanting you there to not wanting you there the next day. You could sell off your furniture and find a home for your pet in one day?

  71. joycemb says:

    I had someone lined up to open my door to people who are buying furniture and to feed my cat while I was gone. I was only planning to stay up there for a few days then come back to finish up things in town here. Yes, she is in a very fragile state right now, I’ve known her a long time. Please pray for her and her son, thanks.

  72. SFDBWV says:

    Joyce we will certainly be in prayer for your friend and her son.

    Steve

  73. street says:

    found this verse and it is working me over pretty good.

    Isaiah 30:15
    For thus the Lord God, the Holy One of Israel, has said, “In repentance and rest you will be saved, In quietness and trust is your strength.” But you were not willing,

    to me the hard part is abiding in this rest and holiness that is provided. the denial part of following is a struggle. i am so glad He wins! everytime

  74. cbrown says:

    Street, you and I have the same view,1cor 13:12. I praise God for His mercy.

  75. joycemb says:

    Jeremiah 32:39 comes to mind “I will give them singleness of heart and action, so that they will always fear me and that all will then go well for them and for their children after them”.

    Them….singleness of heart and action… Reminds me of the phrase “It takes a village” but in the spiritual sense as we are not one but part of many. There is some comfort there I think.

  76. poohpity says:

    “even as the body is one and yet has many members, and all the members of the body, though they are many, are one body, so also is Christ. For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit.…” “As it is, there are many parts, but one body.”

    “with all humility and gentleness, with patience, showing tolerance for one another in love, being diligent to preserve the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. There is one body and one Spirit, just as also you were called in one hope of your calling;…

  77. poohpity says:

    I can not brag about how much I love the Lord or how Spirit filled I am because I fall so short but I can brag about His love for me which never fails and is so very faithful.

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