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The Hidden Right and Left

What were James and John thinking when they infuriated the other Ten by asking for the honor of sitting at Jesus’s right and left— in his coming Kingdom? (Mark 10:35-37, 41)

Jesus had just warned the Group, “We’re going up to Jerusalem, where the Son of Man will be betrayed to the leading priests and the teachers of religious law. They will sentence him to die and hand him over to the Romans. They will mock him, spit on him, flog him with a whip, and kill him, but after three days he will rise again.” (Mark 10:33-34).

With this dark prediction, and the way Mark tells it, we might wonder whether the two brothers wanted their Leader to know they trusted him. But Matthew tells us in his Gospel that it was their mother who prompted the request for her two sons (Matthew 20:20-28).

In any case, Jesus says the brothers (and their mother) don’t know what they are asking. He asks whether they are able to drink from the cup that he is about to drink from? When they indicate that they are ready to do whatever it takes to follow him, their Teacher says, “You will indeed drink from my bitter cup and be baptized with my baptism of suffering. But I have no right to say who will sit on my right or my left. God has prepared those places for the ones he has chosen” (Mark 10:38-40).

In N.T. Wright’s book, “The Day the Revolution Began”, the author says, “Only as Mark’s story reaches its grisly end do readers realize what is meant.

James and John have been asking for the places at Jesus’s right and left so as to accompany him as he completes the glorious work of bringing in God’s kingdom. . . . But those places are reserved for the two who are crucified alongside him as he hangs there with “King of the Jews” above the head.

Is it possible? Could a sign written in three languages, a crown of thorns, and two criminals hanging—at Jesus’s right and left— be hiding honor, goodness, glory, and power far greater than two brothers, their mother, and the rest of the family ever imagined?


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117 Responses to “The Hidden Right and Left”

  1. SFDBWV says:

    This is an interesting concept. I had always took the request of James and John to mean that when Jesus took His throne if they could be honored as being seated alongside Him, in power and glory.

    Yet in this look the honor goes to these two thieves remembered for all time as the two men who died alongside Jesus. Un-named but used By God to send a final message.

    Interesting given the “outrageous” debacle that we just left in our last subject that the thief whom Jesus said would join Him in Paradise rebuked the other for his comments.

    Lots more thinking to do regarding this new subject.

    Steve

  2. jeff1 says:

    When I survey the wondrous cross
    On which the Prince of glory died,
    My richest gain I count but loss,
    And pour contempt on all my pride.

    Forbid it, Lord, that I should boast,
    Save in the death of Christ my God!
    All the vain things that charm me most,
    I sacrifice them to His blood.

    See from His head, His hands, His feet,
    Sorrow and love flow mingled down!
    Did e’er such love and sorrow meet,
    Or thorns compose so rich a crown?

    Where the whole realm of nature mine,
    That where a present far two small;
    Love so amazing; so divine,
    Demands my soul, my life, my all.

  3. SFDBWV says:

    When I looked in on BTA this morning and seen the mess there. I took the time to write a response to it. Upon going to post there was a new subject up titled “Outrageous”.

    So I deleted my response to the subject I had written about and then wrote a quick message to this new one.

    Whereupon when I went to post it the title had changed to “The Hidden Right and Left”.

    I think I will go lay down.

    Steve

  4. jeff1 says:

    Guide me, O thou great Redeemer,
    Pilgrim through this barren land;
    I am weak, but Thou art mighty,
    Hold me with Thy powerful hand;
    Bread of heaven, bread of heaven
    Fill me till I want no more;
    Fill me till I want no more.

    Open now the crystal fountain
    Whence the healing stream doth flow;
    Let the fire and cloudy pillar
    Lead me all my journey through:
    Strong deliverer, strong deliverer;
    Be Thou still my strength and shield;
    Be Thou still my strength and shield.

    When I tread the verge of Jordan,
    Bid my anxious fears subside;
    Death of death, and hell’s destruction
    Land me safe on Canaan’s side:
    Songs of praises, songs of praises,
    I will ever give to Thee;
    I will ever give to Thee.

  5. poohpity says:

    It would seem that the disciples and their families often did not realize what following the King of Glory would entail while here. They often thought that Jesus was going to be a conquering King to over take the Roman oppression not the oppression of their sins, or the high esteem that the Religious leaders put their selves in rather than a suffering servant. The mother of the brothers seemed to want the kind of praise, glory and adoration that their peers gave to Kings, Princes, movie stars and rulers of this world rather than quiet submission to the will of the Father with no fanfare but persecution, crucifixion, hate, rejection, betrayal that Jesus went through. Talk about misunderstanding. If she only knew what she was asking.

    Who would ask that their sons be as James was executed by sword(Acts 12:1-2) for his beliefs or as John was exiled to the island of Patmos for the majority of his life?

  6. poohpity says:

    Did Paul see ahead from being a persecutor of the followers of Jesus held in high regard from the Pharisees and Roman government while boasting in their good works to;

    I have worked harder, been put in prison more often, been whipped times without number, and faced death again and again. Five different times the Jewish leaders gave me thirty-nine lashes. Three times I was beaten with rods. Once I was stoned. Three times I was shipwrecked. Once I spent a whole night and a day adrift at sea. I have traveled on many long journeys. I have faced danger from rivers and from robbers. I have faced danger from my own people, the Jews, as well as from the Gentiles. I have faced danger in the cities, in the deserts, and on the seas. And I have faced danger from men who claim to be believers but are not. I have worked hard and long, enduring many sleepless nights. I have been hungry and thirsty and have often gone without food. I have shivered in the cold, without enough clothing to keep me warm.

    Would you still follow Jesus if you knew what was “The Hidden Right and Left”?

  7. remarutho says:

    Good Morning BTA Friends —

    Moving from the deeply cynical writing of George Steiner to the actual scene of Jesus’ sacrifice is jarring, to say the least.

    Smiled and shed a tear when I read your comment, Steve. Yes, the grisly reality of humans torturing other humans is enough to make any of us want to lie down a while. It is disturbing to the point of causing dizziness and nausea.

    Perhaps we have heard so many times the story of Jesus’ unjust execution — seen so many times the excruciating scenes of His torture and humiliation — that we have ceased to feel compassion any more. Can it be? James and John did not know what they were asking, it seems to me.

    Was interested to read the comment here that Steiner simply used the ugly persona of Adolf Hitler to express his own contempt for the things of God. What Hitler perpetrated echoes the hard cruelty of the Roman practice of hanging people on crosses until they died.

    The image of the three crosses of agony, with their hidden left and right, makes me think of Shusako Endo’s novel, “Silence,” recently made into a film When does what seems like dishonor in the world actually mean great and glorious honor in God’s kingdom? It is a disturbing question, especially when the faithful witness of Christ’s love brings certain horror, torture and death.

    Would I still embrace Jesus if doing so guaranteed suffering and execution?

    Blessings all day,
    Maru

    11C/52F here bright sunny morning — hot day forecast

  8. SFDBWV says:

    The Bible as a whole teaches in various vehicles. Like Jesus who taught with straight talk, parables and life.

    We are to show Him in our actions and deeds. Many honor Him with their mouths, but their deeds show otherwise.

    We being made in His image are a shadow reflection of Him.

    So we also teach by straight talk, parables and life.

    I have shared this with our group before, but it bears repeating in this subject.

    Matthew and I took communion together and ask the Lord to use us as we committed ourselves to Him.

    Within a month He was in a coma with traumatic brain injury, within 4 months my wife of 31 years discovered she had cancer and died one year later in October of 2000.

    Although I had worked a steady full time job since 17 years of age, I was forced to quit working altogether and take up the task of caring for my family with no understanding as how we could make it financially.

    God provided. He still does as I continue to care for Matt.

    If you want to be a follower of Jesus and be of use to Him, quickly understand that your plans and thoughts as to how are gone as He takes control of your life uses you where He wants you and provides the anointing to do so and provides for your needs.

    The two thieves who hung with Jesus had no knowledge that God would use them, but use them God did. If you seek service with God never expect honors and recognition from the world, but do expect others in service to God to recognize Jesus in your service. And see the hand of God as He also uses the unknowing that they too are being used of God as well.

    Praying for BTA.

    Steve

  9. street says:

    Is it possible? Could a sign written in three languages, a crown of thorns, and two criminals hanging—at Jesus’s right and left— be hiding honor, goodness, glory, and power far greater than two brothers, their mother, and the rest of the family ever imagined?

    The Power of True Love for God.

  10. street says:

    thinking of the right and the left coming together in Christ Jesus. is it possible? unity of the whole, undivided? reminded of no agreement between light and dark. choose this day Who/who you will serve. can you serve without changing your mind?

    unwilling to lift up his eyes to heaven, but was beating his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me, the sinner!’

    Luke 6:36
    Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.

    Hebrews 2:17
    Therefore, He had to be made like His brethren in all things, so that He might become a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people.

    Hebrews 8:12
    “For I will be merciful to their iniquities, And I will remember their sins no more.”

  11. street says:

    “You will indeed drink from my bitter cup and be baptized with my baptism of suffering. But I have no right to say who will sit on my right or my left. God has prepared those places for the ones he has chosen” (Mark 10:38-40).

    this makes me stop….it’s better to rest. i notice the complete selflessness and trust in His Fathers will in every detail. Loving God with all His Heart, Mind, Soul, and Strength.

  12. street says:

    thinking about Jesus separating the sheep and the goats to His right and left.

  13. street says:

    to mean that when Jesus took His throne if they could be honored as being seated alongside Him, in power and glory.

    to do this i would seem to me that one would have to drink from His cup of sorrow too. in all ways Christ was made like one of us, save sin, so that we could be made like Him.

  14. street says:

    thinking of communion and the price that was paid to participate in Christ joy. may every day and every step bring me closer to my Father.

    Isaiah 6:3 …“Holy, Holy, Holy, is the Lord of hosts,
    The whole earth is full of His glory.”

    John 14:18
    “I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you.

    He did come to earth to save us and went away for a little while and He will come back. thinking of the talents He entrusted to us. the talents that have been through the water and fire.

  15. jeff1 says:

    I am not worthy, holy Lord,
    That Thou shouldst come to me;
    Speak but the word; one gracious word
    Can set the sinner free.

    I am not worthy; cold and bare
    The lodging of my soul;
    How canst Thou deign to enter there?
    Lord, speak, and make me whole.

    I am not worthy; yet my God,
    How can I say Thee nay;
    Thee, who didst give Thy flesh and blood
    My ransom price to pay?

    O come! in sweet morning hour
    Feed me with food divine;
    And fill with all Thy love and power
    This worthless heart of mine.

    Written by Henry Williams Baker
    whose friend John Ellerton reported that Baker’s dying words were from his famous hymn:

    Perverse and foolish oft I strayed,
    But yet in love He sought me,
    And on His shoulder gently laid,
    And home, rejoicing, brought me.

  16. joycemb says:

    I was thinking about how my life changed after I gave myself over to God. The first about 6 weeks were ecstatically joyful. Then all hell broke loose. Some terribly awful things began to happen and the snowball effect is with me today. Many many disappointments, deep deep sadness and shock wondering how could God allow these things to happen to me. Going through the fire though changed my perspective like it did with the disciples, over time.

    There’s an old song that has been going through my mind lately that goes like this:
    Clowns to the left of me
    Jokers to the right
    Here I am-
    Stuck in the middle with you.

    There’s a lot of similarities to the topic I think.

  17. street says:

    good to be stuck in love instead of emptyness

  18. joycemb says:

    Amen

  19. poohpity says:

    If Jesus said about those who would sit at His right or left, “but it is for those for whom it has been prepared by my Father.” how would N.T. Wright know it was for those who hung beside Jesus? Just like the people who say they know when the end times will come, when Jesus did not even know, isn’t that just an assumption?

    I think Jesus went on to explain the difference in wanting praise and glory like Jesus when Matthew continues by repeating what Jesus said, “You know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their great ones exercise authority over them. It shall not be so among you. But whoever would be great among you must be your servant, and whoever would be first among you must be your slave, even as the Son of Man came not to be served but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”

    Wouldn’t the request of the mother be sort of like coming from someone who may not really have a grasp at who Jesus is? I do not know how others may think but it would be like finding a sort of equality to God as Jesus is.

  20. poohpity says:

    I think there is a big difference in life happening and the things that happen because of one’s faith in Jesus.

  21. joycemb says:

    I just want to tell those who weren’t involved with the hippie/rock and roll culture as I once was the song I mentioned is about a successful band that discovered success brought out the vultures and the promoters/agents who wanted money from them all the time. they felt trapped and stuck. Yep street to be stuck in love- Christ- is true freedom! I’m so glad He rescued me! :-)

  22. Dinakar says:

    Surely when Jesus replied to the mother of the two He wasn’t talking about who would hang beside Him.

    The background to the incident is that both John and James were already in the inner circle of disciples and in some sense it goes against Peter rather than the others. James and John were the relatives of the high priest and as such were part of the ‘who is who’ in Jerusalem in the early 1st century. Their mother wanted to make sure in the new kingdom to come they had the best place secured. John had easy access to the High priest home post arrest of Jesus and helped Peter pass the gate and at the beautiful gate incident both Peter and John were released.

    Jesus was always about LOVE and serving others rather than prestige and pomp alongside with pride. To work along side Him with humility and a broken spirit is a privilege to be strived after.To forget yourself and take up your cross is a daily task

    Dinakar

  23. SFDBWV says:

    Thank you Dinakar for your reality check.

    Steve

  24. jeff1 says:

    Thinking it is God who chooses His warriors just as it is He who chooses His peace makers because He knows the hearts of men. While I make assumptions based on my beliefs which lets face it were beliefs that I inherited and lived by for the most of my life until I woke up to the fact that Jesus is much more than one’s indoctrinated beliefs.

    Truthfully it is God who draws people to Himself and not Christians. Christians throughout history have according to their beliefs honoured God but what would God say about it?

    I have never read my bible but was raised in a community where I was listening to those who were well versed on it and that is why I ended up deciding I would rather listen to the stories of the characters in the bible rather than study it.

    For me as an outsider I was able to see that their interpretations was based on their beliefs and not on a heart given to God and drawn by the indwelling Spirit to know God.

    Why in a modern society are the younger generations looking elsewhere because it is us who fail God and not God who fails us.

    I am part of the body of Christ and as such when other Christians fail to understand God then I am part of that failure.

    Personally I may lead a life pleasing to God or not but the church’s one foundation is Jesus Christ on earth and it is the church that will imitate God that will to my way of thinking be the one that mirrors the one true God.

    I go to church for me because I feel closer to God in a church and when I take communion I feel closer to God but I do not look and make assumptions about others any more and I used to until I realized I do not know the heart of each man and women in this church anymore than they know mine.

    I have learned that my expectations of them was totally unrealistic because I put ‘law’ before ‘love’ and learned the hard way that Paul was right ‘without love’ all else is worthless.

  25. poohpity says:

    Dinkar, I have never heard those things about John and James, I thought their families were fisherman. I know John the Baptist came from the Priesthood from Elizabeth and Zechariah but not the sons of Zebedee and Salome. Interesting. It is neat to have someone dig deeper on the topic. Can you show me where you learned those things about what happened in the courtyard? I enjoy learning.

  26. poohpity says:

    I was thinking that the disciples often asked strange questions of Jesus but it seemed to be because they really had not yet understood the purpose and mission of Jesus. Like Peter telling Jesus not to go to Jerusalem to face what He was about to face(Matt 16:21-23). So in that I do think that no one surrounding Jesus then knew of the hiding honor, goodness, glory, and power far greater than they could have imagined. I do not think it really made any sense until after when they had the visits from the risen Savior and the help of the Holy Spirit.

  27. street says:

    I do not think it really made any sense until after when they had the visits from the risen Savior and the help of the Holy Spirit.

    44 He said to them, “This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms.”

    45 Then he opened their minds so they could understand the Scriptures. 46 He told them, “This is what is written: The Messiah will suffer and rise from the dead on the third day,

  28. street says:

    when Jesus opened their minds, this was before Pentecost. they were instructed to stay in the city till this happen.

  29. street says:

    just thinking what keeps a mind from being open? we understand the 11 were willing and following. thinking about the two pillars out in front of God’s Temple, Solomon built. they had names that meant “renew” and “strength”. coupled with the presents of God. with God not apart from Him. Ephesians 2:4-7

  30. poohpity says:

    street, hope this helps with your question about opening minds. Romans 8:5 NIV

  31. jeff1 says:

    Weary of earth, and laden with my sin,
    I look to heaven and long to enter in,
    But there no evil thing may find a home:
    And yet I hear a voice that bids me “Come.”

    So vile I am, how dare I hope to stand
    In the pure glory of that holy land?
    Before the whiteness of that Throne appear?
    Yet their are Hands stretch’d out to draw me near.

    The while I fain would tread the heavenly way,
    Evil is ever with me, day by day;
    Yet on my ears the gracious tidings fall,
    “Repent, confess, thou shall be loosed from all.”

    It is the voice of Jesus that I hear,
    His are the Hands stretch’d out to draw me near,
    And His the Blood that can for all atone,
    And set me faultless there before the Throne.

    ‘Twas He who found me on the deathly wild,
    And made me heir of heaven, the Father’s child,
    And day by day, whereby my soul may live,
    Give me His grace of pardon, and will give.

    Yea, Thou wilt answer for me, Righteous Lord;
    Thine all the merits, mine the great reward;
    Thine the sharp thorns, and mine the golden crown,
    Mine the life won, and Thine the life laid down.

  32. street says:

    street, hope this helps with your question about opening minds. Romans 8:5 NIV

    poo the point i was thinking of is not the state of the mind, but the emphasis on the presents of God. saul,the first king, God was with him early on but was rejected because of disobedience and a closed mind.

    remembering the disciples being told about bringing prayer into the picture when they could not cast out a demon in a child. could the fasting and prayer be,” i must decrease He must increase?” this is something we are not in control of , but a work of God in harmony with mans will and consent. there are a lot of things i don’t consent to, but God lets them happen because His thought are far higher than mine. the cup of sorrow and pain is deep, but let me not be found apart from Christ Who strengths and guides His flock.

  33. poohpity says:

    street, I will have remember when you ask a question like, “just thinking what keeps a mind from being open?”, that you really do not mean what you ask, so I will have to guess what you did not mean to answer what you did mean!

  34. street says:

    When does what seems like dishonor in the world actually mean great and glorious honor in God’s kingdom? It is a disturbing question, especially when the faithful witness of Christ’s love brings certain horror, torture and death.

    Would I still embrace Jesus if doing so guaranteed suffering and execution?

    thinking about poos quote of scripture of the mind fix on the flesh and the mind fixed on the Spirit. both are going to die. one is a self centered death the other live giving death. i guess how you see this is how you see the cross and the full measure of love or contempt.

    thinking of Christ sitting at the right hand of God waiting for His enemies to be made a footstool.
    called to walk before Him blameless.

    Lord, who may dwell in your sacred tent?
    Who may live on your holy mountain?

    2
    The one whose walk is blameless,

    in Christ and walking. soaring is fun, but i know it starts with profound lowness or ends in humility.
    I will never leave you nor forsake you. thank You

  35. street says:

    But knowledge puffs up while love builds up.

  36. street says:

    street, I will have remember when you ask a question like, “just thinking what keeps a mind from being open?”, that you really do not mean what you ask, so I will have to guess what you did not mean to answer what you did mean!

    sorry poo the question i ask, my hope is the reader will understand the answer without a word being said. like pauls questions in Romans, than again i am no paul.

    things get real crazy till Jesus shows up.

    one of the things that mart has helped me understand is that how we read the Bible and other is how we read ourselves. the meeting of Jesus destroys every thought and idea that is raised against Him. the cross is the only way to go. every other way is a lie, a thief, and a destroyer.

  37. joycemb says:

    Thinking of Marts last paragraph, “Come, let us return to the Lord.
    For He has torn us, but He will heal us;
    He has [a]wounded us, but He will bandage us.” Hosea

    It’s always comforting for me to see the progression of Gods plan for the world.

  38. jeff1 says:

    Yes, Joyce, it is so comforting to both see God working in the world and to feel close to Him. Music is such a great way to feel close to God. It keeps my mind from allowing Satan to discourage me and gives me the peace of mind I need to stay well.

  39. joycemb says:

    Maru when I read/studied Silence in college lit I was stunned by it, but could not disagree, although many of my fellow students did. The painful humility of Christ’s death for us all still brings a tear to my eye also, sometimes more. Wonder when the full meaning of what Jesus had done really hit them. Must have been a very difficult day, knowing Him as intimately as they had. Sometimes I think we can only imagine, until we get to know Him more and more intimately as well.

  40. joycemb says:

    Oh I know Viv. I may have talked about this before but it warms my heart every time I remember how God gave the gift of music to Saul through David to calm and soothe him when he was tormented. God is so good.

  41. joycemb says:

    New American Standard 1977
    So it came about whenever the evil spirit from God came to Saul, David would take the harp and play it with his hand; and Saul would be refreshed and be well, and the evil spirit would depart from him.

  42. joycemb says:

    How merciful David was, not surprising our Messiah came from Davids blood line.

  43. poohpity says:

    lol street I will have to get my mind reading hat on but I have to say I am not very good at it so I would just rather read what is written but I thought that was fairly obvious but as usual I was wrong, sorry for the misunderstanding.

  44. SFDBWV says:

    For me there are differences in reading the Bible and studying the Bible. I may need a little uplifting and so read the Psalms, but then when reading such a “story” as Mart has given us may require more than what is given at the surface.

    Obviously the concern of a mother for her sons is foremost in this story. Understanding Jewish tradition she wanted her sons exalted in the social order of the life she knew and understood.

    It is obvious that nearly no one understood what Jesus had been telling them about the “son of man”. So confused were most that they were even afraid to ask Jesus what the heck was He talking about. Making them feel stupid. So they tried to guess using their earthly understanding of everything.

    Like all prophesy everything became clear “after” the fact.

    The Bible is a marvelous vehicle of giving a statement or a story that is literal, but also spiritual as well as an allegory. Key to the hidden view is held within our own hearts. We look for a meaning we may already have a prejudice for.

    Many will say that the Holy Spirit will explain. But is it their explanation or actually a supernatural intervention between that person and God?

    I have found that in my experience when the Holy Spirit is involved in such a revelation that along with it always comes conformation from another source. It may be another person, another verse or several verses, it may be a song that opens your eyes and heart to a supernatural understanding. But however comes the conformation it is accompanied with a secure peace. You know, because you know. Once instituted in your heart it is unshakeable.

    May your faith be unshakeable as you experience all today has in store for you.

    66 muggy under clear skies.

    Steve

  45. joycemb says:

    That is my experience with the Holy Spirit also, that when told something in my spirit its always confirmed in this fleshly plane, and it often comes in the most obscure ways! Oh that Holy Spirit is like the wind and you never know which way its going or where it came from, but you know it will show up, always!

  46. joycemb says:

    Just in case… Yes I know the Holy
    Spirit comes from God.

  47. SFDBWV says:

    Ok one of my abstract stories…

    I told earlier of having so many sunflower plants growing this year around my “feeding” rock. Later, as would have it one morning I looked out and there stood on its hind legs a huge groundhog eating his way up the stalk of the best of them.

    I quickly dispatched the whistle pig with my 22 caliber rifle I keep in the kitchen for just such “rats”.

    Sadly the plant was broken in half and mostly eaten, it could not be saved.

    At least there were still several others standing tall and growing healthy.

    Then one morning as I went out to feed I noticed some of the leaves of the next plant were chewed nearly off the stalk, but the head bud not bothered. This particular plant was my favorite as it had multiple buds coming on for a future bright yellow display.

    Discouraged, but watchful a few mornings later I found that all of the leaves on this plant were eaten except for the very top reaches of the plant. Given the size of the plant and the nature of how the leaves had been eaten it was clearly a deer who had been coming in to only eat on this one sunflower plant.

    To my joy this plant produced the brightest yellow sunflower of all and has for the past week or more greeted me every morning with its bright face toward the east.

    Then later this morning as I looked out, there on each side of the sunflowers bright mature flower are two other smaller flowers. One on each side of the bigger brighter flower. Hanging there in their full glory as if a representation of the three crosses at Calvary. Nearly in the shape of a cross.

    I took a picture of it for my Christmas cards and took the time to share it with you.

    I hope you all get the connection as I did.

    Steve

  48. poohpity says:

    Jesus seemed to always make them comfortable in asking questions by telling them to ask. Even when the questions as these were about seating questions about the Kingdom to come which were prideful and arrogant. He taught with words and deeds that pride and arrogance has no place with Him for His followers. Even after these questions and right before He went to the Cross He took off His outer garments and washed their feet telling them that since He was their Lord and Teacher and washed their feet which was a humbling experience they ought to do likewise.

    Repeatedly Jesus taught not only the disciples but also the religious leaders about humility. These next verses shows that among many many more.

    “When Jesus noticed that all who had come to the dinner were trying to sit in the seats of honor near the head of the table, he gave them this advice: 8 “When you are invited to a wedding feast, don’t sit in the seat of honor. What if someone who is more distinguished than you has also been invited? 9 The host will come and say, ‘Give this person your seat.’ Then you will be embarrassed, and you will have to take whatever seat is left at the foot of the table!

    10 “Instead, take the lowest place at the foot of the table. Then when your host sees you, he will come and say, ‘Friend, we have a better place for you!’ Then you will be honored in front of all the other guests. 11 For those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.” Luke 14

  49. poohpity says:

    There has never been a teacher that is worth a hill of beans that does not promote asking questions actually many have said the only stupid questions are those not asked.

  50. poohpity says:

    Steve, are you saying in your sunflower story that one creature has the right to eat from nature while the other does not. If I remember right you said you did not know how those sunflower plants got there so if God had made them grow there then wouldn’t they be for all His creatures. One not being more deserving than another.

  51. poohpity says:

    I see the connection. The flesh decides when someone is better than another like John and James while to God all are the same and the lowliness of one may one day bring great glory and honor.

  52. joycemb says:

    uffdah

  53. joycemb says:

    Thanks steve, quite a story!

  54. poohpity says:

    Isaiah 29:13; Matthew 15:8-9; Mark 7:6

  55. poohpity says:

    The hearts that really worship God from these verses are those who are humble not arrogant, rude or prideful. Jesus also said that the disciples may not understand at the point of Him washing their feet what it all means but one day they would.

  56. joycemb says:

    So are you saying that Steve is arrogant, rude or prideful since you followed up on his story?

  57. joycemb says:

    Oh Lord I’m out of here. Have a good day all.

  58. SFDBWV says:

    My apologies to all in suggesting any of you may see what I seen in my sunflower story. It wasn’t fair of me to expect or even suggest that any of you might.

    It appears that my attempt to share a little uplifting story of nature was hijacked.

    Joyce, don’t let evil steal your joy, just recognize it for what it is and step over it.

    For what it is worth, I will not let another keep me from enjoying the natural things around me as I see God everywhere I look. He is there to be seen and enjoyed. As when such moments occur it is a gift from Him.

    Please be blessed today. Still praying for BTA.

    Steve

  59. poohpity says:

    Joyce, I know it is very uncommon on here but I was addressing the topic not anything else. No I was not calling Steve arrogant, rude or prideful, I was talking about John, James and their mom. I was following up on the topic and when I talked to Steve I said so.

  60. poohpity says:

    Joyce, always remember I do not think like you nor behave as you do. Not saying there is anything wrong with what you do or say but you are you and I am me. Each person being a unique individual and I am not a group thinker.

  61. remarutho says:

    Good Morning BTA Friends —

    I also appreciate the sunflower story. The ruin of some that breaks our hearts is so often followed by that “resurrection” of others that blesses our socks off and gives great consolation.

    The Apostle Paul said we “see through a glass darkly.” So often the awesome glory of God in Christ is obscured by what Wright called the “grisly end” of things seen from a worldly perspective.

    What a wonder that the “baptism of suffering” brings in the kingdom of our God and His Christ. We can only marvel, it seems to me. There is no earthly explanation for this.

    Joy all day,
    Maru

    15C/59F here in the valley. Forecast to be clear and hot.

  62. joycemb says:

    Steve, don’t let one perspective steal YOUR joy. I was reminded that a devils advocate has a purpose also, that purpose to strengthen others in their faith. Remember Job, the disciples, the prophets, Jesus? Count it all joy! James 1:2

    You have nothing to apologize for. We are all learning here and growing in grace.
    Love in Christ Jesus,
    Joyce

  63. poohpity says:

    I was also repeating some of the teaching of Jesus and the examples He gave His followers in accordance to the topic.

  64. poohpity says:

    See Maru was talking about the topic which is most often the case.

  65. poohpity says:

    Steve asked about seeing the connection of the sunflower story with the topic and I simply saw how it did.

  66. joycemb says:

    Sure pooh. but your different thinking is so often contrary to God’s teachings of love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, gentleness etc.

  67. joycemb says:

    Romans 6:4 is appropriate here I think. But you may not agree pooh.

  68. joycemb says:

    Maru I enjoy listening to NT with his very British accent. It’s such a privilege to be able to learn from people all over the world. God’s world, indeed!!

  69. poohpity says:

    Joyce if you do not understand that my comments apply to the topic how would you know what the condition of my heart is? Talk about the topic and the teaching of Jesus and stop talking about me, please because it is all done in ugliness and lack of knowledge about what Jesus actually taught. It seems when people do not understand the topic it always goes to talking about people instead.

  70. joycemb says:

    You may have a point there pooh, although it’s hard to tell when you say something about someone’s post that’s negative that you are only thinking about Marts post. Perhaps you could explain better? Thanks

  71. poohpity says:

    Just know on a whole my comments are about the topic and the others are usually trying to defend myself which is wrong. If one reads the topic then they could see that.

  72. street says:

    —at Jesus’s right and left— be hiding honor, goodness, glory, and power far greater than two brothers, their mother, and the rest of the family ever imagined?

    hiding the honor of love,
    the goodness of love,
    the glory of love,
    and the power of love,
    that is far greater than understanding, comprehension or knowledge. God I hate myself.

  73. jeff1 says:

    The love of God is greater far
    Than tongue or pen can ever tell.
    It goes beyond the highest star
    And reaches to the lowest hell.
    The guilty pair, bowed down with care,
    God gave His Son to win;
    His erring child He reconciled
    And pardoned from His sin.

    O love of God, how rich and pure!
    How measureless and strong!
    It shall forevermore endure–
    The saints’ and angels’ song.

    When hoary time shall pass away
    And earthly thrones and kingdoms fall;
    When men who hear refuse to pray,
    On rocks and hills and mountains call;
    God’s love, so sure, shall still endure,
    All measureless and strong;
    Redeeming grace to Adam’s race–
    The saints’ and angels’ song.

    Could we with ink the ocean fill,
    And were the skies of parchment made;
    Were every stalk on earth a quill,
    And every man a scribe by trade;
    To write the love of God above
    Would drain the ocean dry;
    Nor could the scroll contain the whole,
    Though stretched from sky to sky.

  74. joycemb says:

    Street: As opposed to the honor of self-Goodness of self-Glory of self-Power of self?
    Yes it is I think.

  75. joycemb says:

    Yet God said to love Him with our whole selves and our neighbor as ourself. It means giving up our “selves” by dying just as James and John did. Death to self means esteeming God and others as better than ourselves.
    Unholy self is changed by death going through death, just as Jesus showed us. Could that be what Paul meant when he said we are changed from glory to glory? Sounds kind of gruesome which is why we resist it sometimes. I’d rather have a tiara and a place of honor. I understand the mom of the brothers. Who would want death for their children? I lost a child in a fire, the grief is horrific but the hope of future glory with everlasting life takes a bit of the sadness out of it. I digress.

  76. street says:

    A new commandment I give to you, that you love one,[Deuteronomy 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one.], another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another. By this all men will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.”

    i hate what i have become in the first adam and have great hope in the second Adam.

  77. joycemb says:

    Loving one another….I’m thinking that dialogue instead of relying on one’s instincts and intellect all the time is the way to go. Jesus talked a lot to those who didn’t know the depth of love that was standing right in front of them. He explained things to some but more often just talked about the scriptures and God’s plan for their lives, knowing they had not been given the ability to fully understand God’s plan of redemption.

    God always knows what He is doing. He knew James and Johns hearts before they even spoke, yet didn’t shame or talk down to them or ignore them even. It’s all part of Gods great plan. His will will be done, on earth as it is in heaven. Gives me hope for myself and everyone. The journey may not be pleasant always, but the Future looks great!

  78. SFDBWV says:

    Once again, like a thousand times before, as I stood in the yard this morning with the sky mostly overcast, the eastern sky exploded with those brilliant colors of orange and red and pink and yellow as the coming light of a rising sun pushed the colors above the horizon.

    I am always awe struck at the beauty of the moment as it evolves before my eyes. I always feel so very close to God at such times. A feeling that is very difficult to adequately express with words. Perhaps enraptured or elated may come close.

    Reminded by Mart’s opening statement is that the other 10 disciples were “infuriated” at James and John for asking for such an honor from Jesus. I wonder had they known or suspected that the position on the left and right of Jesus would have been an equal crucifixion if they would have been so quick to get angry.

    Of course they were clueless as to what lay ahead for Jesus or for all of them for that matter and only looked at the request as an insult against the rest of them.

    I am reminded of what it is I ask from God every day every hour every time I talk to God. Each “official” prayer or each little moment when I just quietly talk to Him.

    Truth is I have never ask for anything special above another person. The things I ask for are common to us all.

    Publicly as in church services and even on some rather annoying TV preaching shows I don’t ever recall someone asking for such an honor from Jesus as to be on His left or right as He sets on His throne.

    Yet as you study the word, we are considered co heirs of His Kingdom. So while not so much as this one or that one among us as to His left or right, we are all behind Him and surround Him as His clouds of glory.

    In my imagination if any two of His disciples were to be considered #1 and #2 it would be Peter and Paul, though each of the others played out their roles unto their deaths and countless thousands have over these past 2 thousand years as well.

    As for me God told me many years ago I would make it, now I just want those I love to make it as well and please God in doing so. I want to fulfill my purpose for Him. My goal is between God and me, not between me and any others.

    Yes it is easy to see how others get “infuriated” when they think another is asking something special of God or maybe even seem to brag about how their relationship with God is.

    Equally understood is how if they really knew what that relationship involved they may not be so quick to get angry; or be jealous of.

    60 degrees under partial cloudy skies…muggy.

    Steve

  79. jeff1 says:

    Thinking it’s still God who has the greater love because while I love in part there are areas where I do not which leaves my love lacking.

    If my love is not whole then it is worthless because I cannot love those God wants me to love i.e. my enemies.

    God’s love goes deeper than mine because it looks at the whole person while I look at what I see and if I like what I see then love comes easy but when I don’t like what I see that is where I fail God.

    There is a big difference in believing God and following God to my way of thinking.

    Without knowing the depth of God’s love how can I love another as God loves it is just not possible?

    I struggle loving other followers of Christ let alone my enemies so I fall very short of what it is to follow Christ!

    When is a Christian a Christian when they believe in God or when they are fully committed to His ways?

  80. jeff1 says:

    When I think of what the disciples suffered I would say they proved themselves to be His disciples.

    How small my portion to the great warriors of Christ’s and how great my reward to know that God’s love extends to my portion.

    Nothing to this world I bring, simply to the cross I cling.

    Rock of Ages, cleft for me.
    Let me hide myself in Thee;
    Let the water and the blood,
    From Thy risen side which flowed.
    Be of sin the double cure,
    Cleanse me from its guilt and power.

    Not he labours of my hands
    Can fulfil Thy law’s demands;
    Could my zeal no respite know,
    Could my tears forever flow,
    All for sin could not atone;
    Thou must save and Thou alone.

    Nothing in my hand I bring,
    Simply to the cross I cling;
    Naked, come to Thee for dress;
    Helpless, look to Thee for grace;
    Foul, I to the Fountain fly;
    Wash me, Saviour, or I die.

    While I draw this fleeting breath,
    When my eye-strings break in death,
    When I soar through tracts unknown,
    See Thee on Thy judgement throne.
    Rock of Ages, cleft for me.
    Let me hide myself in Thee.

  81. SFDBWV says:

    Good morning Viv, as one song/poem aficionado to another may I recommend another Leonard Cohen song “Show Me the Place”. I think you would like the words, I do.

    Always remember that the first 12 Disciples were also human and also had flaws, some of which we have discussed here.

    Personally I do not think you fail God at all Viv, I think you are just who God wants you to be. If He expected more of you He would anoint you and empower you to whatever task it was He wanted of you.

    Be happy with being Viv, I believe He is, I know I am.

    Steve

  82. poohpity says:

    Very good and thoughtful encouragement for Viv, Steve.

    God has lived with Human beings since He created them and it does not seem He has expectations like we human’s do of ourselves and each other. He knows!

    John later referred to Himself as the “disciple Jesus loved” not excluding others but it seems more like understanding the love God had for him and all others. It seems our faith in God is what pleases Him(Hebrews 11:6 NIV) and He seems to understand fully our inabilities that is why we were given the Holy Spirit to live this life, not perfectly but in the process of becoming more like Him.

    David referred to himself as “a man AFTER God’s own heart” but as with everyone else in the bible fell very short of perfection. He sought AFTER God, He searched for, learned about and spent time in communication Him.

  83. poohpity says:

    I was wrong that was not David who referred himself that way but God who called him that.

  84. joycemb says:

    Seedbed Daily Text has a very powerful message on John 15:9. It’s very short but brought tears to my eyes.

  85. poohpity says:

    Jesus taught us how we can come to love our enemies by praying for them and doing good things for them.

    Woe to you when everyone speaks well of you, for that is how their ancestors treated the false prophets. “But to you who are listening I say: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, 28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.” Luke 6 and Proverbs 25:21; Matthew 5:44-45 NLT our hearts turn. Sometimes it happens right away but other times it takes time and effort.

  86. joycemb says:

    Amen pooh!

  87. joycemb says:

    Ever prayed so hard and so long for an enemy they became a friend? It’s awesome. We were all enemies of God at one time, but Jesus prayed for us. Even MORE awesome!

  88. joycemb says:

    I’m thinking if we are focusing on what others think/expect from us we have taken our eyes off God and heavenly things. I tried for years to live up to other’s expectations not understanding that if my focus was on God all the time I had access to as James said wisdom that is true, honest, just, lovely, pure etc etc. There is no guilt, judgement, condemnation, hypocrisy etc in wisdom from God. The flesh likes to cake up like mud sometimes doesn’t it. Washing of the Word breaks up the clods.

  89. joycemb says:

    Lol at myself!

  90. jeff1 says:

    Steve, I believe I fail God because it is I who still have hatred for my enemies and I have tried not to have by stopping listening to them but I find it hard because I lived with their hatred and the consequences of it which was devastating for us.

    Its hard to forget when you see reminders i.e. knowing many people who were victims of terrorism and seeing how their circumstances effected them.

    I had an aunt who lost her 19 year old and she and her husband never got over it so there is much suffering for those effected that you have to consider so it not just about my feelings but my feelings towards people I care about.

    I trust God but I have difficulty trusting people because they let you down when it matters.

    I still see myself as an enemy of God because love is what matters and I cannot feel that love which is sad but true.

    I watched a programme where this doctor was dying and he said to his friend when people ask me do I believe in life after death I said I’m not sure that there is life before death.

    I tend to agree with him because if I didn’t believe in a better world to come I would struggle even more to survive this one.

  91. SFDBWV says:

    We have had huge thunder storms and heavy rain all day. I had turned off the computer earlier and just turned it back on and so thought I would check in.

    It’s ok Viv, but I want to tell you this before I sign out again. You have not failed God in being a normal human being with feelings and emotions. Rather it is other people who have failed you. You are a victim of circumstances beyond your control.

    God loves you Viv and so do I.

    Steve

  92. street says:

    2
    before the sun and the light
    and the moon and the stars grow dark,
    and the clouds return after the rain;
    3
    when the keepers of the house tremble,
    and the strong men stoop,
    when the grinders cease because they are few,
    and those looking through the windows grow dim;
    4
    when the doors to the street are closed
    and the sound of grinding fades;
    when people rise up at the sound of birds,
    but all their songs grow faint;

    Your Word remains. unshakable unstoppable unchangeable and they are delightful, the full measure there of.

  93. street says:

    25
    When terror comes,
    they will seek peace in vain.
    26
    Calamity upon calamity will come,
    and rumor upon rumor.
    They will go searching for a vision from the prophet,
    priestly instruction in the law will cease,
    the counsel of the elders will come to an end.
    27
    The king will mourn,
    the prince will be clothed with despair,
    and the hands of the people of the land will tremble.
    I will deal with them according to their conduct,
    and by their own standards I will judge them.

    “‘Then they will know that I am the Lord.’”

    the urgency, and need to know the Lord.

  94. jeff1 says:

    Thank you Steve, for your reassurance of God’s love and yours. I know in my better days that it is true and listening to my hymns and songs does also give me peace of mind.

    I must focus on God’s and good people like your self’s love for me and not on those who hate otherwise they win and take my joy.

    Thanks again Steve, for you have your own trials and I should be strengthened by how you have coped with yours rather than allowing others to distract me to their bad deeds.

    God is always good and that is the truth that matters and you are such a fine example, Steve, of a Godly person and I am blessed to be here to share my fears and hear your words of encouragement.

  95. joycemb says:

    I like this perspective, “Instead of feeling embarrassed by brothers and sisters (myself also) who struggle with desperately weak assurance, with mental illness, or with traumas so severe that brains have been altered and minds shattered, perhaps we should recognize these as the true heroes of our faith.”

    Barb Duguid
    Author, Extravagant Grace: God’s Glory Displayed in Our Weakness

  96. joycemb says:

    Heros: those hanging to the left and right of Jesus. And the rest who follow in His footsteps, however falteringly.

  97. jeff1 says:

    Sung by an Irish singer Daniel O’Donnell, I love the simplicity of this song because often my walk with God seems anything but.

    Footsteps walking with me
    Footsteps I cannot see
    But every move I make
    And every step I take
    I know they’re there with me
    They walk with me all the way
    Beside me day by day
    Through good and bad
    Through happy and sad
    Those footsteps won’t go away

    I’ll never walk in life alone
    There’ll always be someone there
    I know He won’t let me down
    He’s with me everywhere
    The special things in life I’ve done
    Have been through Him and His love
    I’ve been blessed in so many ways
    Thanks to the Lord above

    Footsteps walking with me
    Footsteps I cannot see
    But every move I make
    And every step I take
    I know they’re there with me
    They walk with me all the way
    Beside me day by day
    Through good and bad
    Through happy and sad
    Those footsteps won’t go away

    I think that my life’s been planned
    By the one who’s guiding me
    When I’m led by the hand
    Of someone I can’t see
    I’m not always sure where to go
    That’s when I follow his lead
    I know that the pathways that He shows
    Will help me to succeed
    Footsteps walking with me (footsteps walking)
    Footsteps I cannot see (cannot see)
    But every more I make
    And every step I take
    I know they’re there with me
    They walk with me all the way
    Beside me day by day
    Through good and bad
    Through happy and sad
    Those footsteps won’t go away
    Through good and bad
    Through happy and sad
    By my side they will stay

  98. SFDBWV says:

    Thank you Viv for your kind words. It is very humbling for me to be compared to your beloved father. I will try always to live up to such an honor.

    For all as well. It occurred to me that Paul at the conclusion of nearly all of his letters gave credit and kudos to those people whom he felt were doing a good job.

    It seems to me that it is essential for we Christians to uplift each other with encouragements when appropriate. Paul had lots of help along his journey, sadly his biggest problems, aside from Jewish authorities and Roman law, were within the church fathers there in Jerusalem.

    The same problems were present from the beginning of the world, the beginning of the church and right here right now. Satan wanted to be worshiped or at least held in high esteem.
    Some people are no different, maybe all people given the right circumstance.

    When cults are established at first, similar to the communist or socialist ideology, everyone is equal and everyone works for the betterment of each other’s welfare.

    But that soon changes.

    In the story of King Arthur he used a “round’ table so as not to give the impression there was someone at the head of the table.

    But all of the knights knew who was King.

    I don’t know if N.T. Wright was right or not, it is an interesting look at the passage. But I believe if anyone wants to be “up there” with Jesus they have to start at the end of the line, in the back of the room. As His slave, under orders, intent to obey and please. With no regard as to position except to be used by Him for His purpose and His desires and His will.

    In fact “up there” could simply mean to be with Him. Not in any seat of power, just simply to be with Him.

    69 degrees with rain, 2.25 inches of rain yesterday and overnight.

    Steve

  99. jeff1 says:

    Satan wanted to be worshipped or at least held in high esteem. Some people are no different, maybe all people given the right circumstance.

    I think you are right, Steve, that if anyone of us found ourselves in different circumstances where others where looking at us with adoration then our struggle to be humble would be a much greater one.

    It is easy to say I will ‘never’ behave like that no matter what but if I have learned anything in life it is not to say ‘never’.

    God knows human nature better than we know ourselves because it is easy to see wrong behaviour in another and still be oblivious to the wrong behaviour in yourself.

    I think Steve like the song I posted says ‘footsteps walking with me, footsteps I cannot see’ is ‘God With Us’.

    This hymn I heard this morning and it always remains a favourite of mine and timeless.

    I am weak, but Thou art strong;
    Jesus, keep me from all wrong;
    I’ll be satisfied as long
    As I walk, let me walk close to Thee.

    Just a closer walk with Thee,
    Grant it, Jesus, is my plea,
    Daily, walking close to Thee,
    Let it be, dear Lord, let it be.

    Through this world of toils and snares,
    If I falter, Lord, who cares?
    Who with me my burden shares?
    None but Thee, dear Lord, none but Thee.

    When my feeble life is o’er,
    Time for me will be no more;
    Guide me gently, safely o’er
    To Thy kingdom shore, to Thy shore.

    Just a closer walk with Thee,
    Grant it, Jesus, is my plea,
    Daily walking close to Thee,
    Let it be, dear Lord, let it be.

  100. SFDBWV says:

    Viv among my books is a song book of “All Time Inspirational Favorites”. In it are many of the songs we have all heard or sung in church. Kenneth Morris’ “Just a Closer Walk With Thee” is one among many that I enjoy.

    The first year after having Matt home from the hospital I would sing along with him any or many of these songs. Just like love, music never dies when entrenched in the heart.

    I still joke about it with him, that I can remember the melody of most songs, but can’t remember the words. While he, even still, once nudged remembers the words to any song he ever heard.

    Thanks for the memory.

    Steve

  101. foreverblessed says:

    I also do think that Mart is focussed on unity between left and right in the US.

    That his topics aim at unity.

    I do go with what Dinakar has written.

    But as I have written before, that I was so amazed when it dawned on me, that the disciples were just oblivious to Jesus announcements of his upcoming death!
    This one of Mark 10:32-34 was not the first one.
    In Mark 8:31-38 He already had done that.
    Plus: whoever wants to follow Me, he must deny himself.

    So I am thinking, what do we take for granted now, as christians, that Christ meant differently?

  102. joycemb says:

    “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil. For everyone who does wicked things hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his works should be exposed. But whoever does what is true comes to the light, so that it may be clearly seen that his works have been carried out in God.”

  103. jeff1 says:

    When I am down and oh my soul so weary
    When troubles come and my heart burdened be
    Then I am still and wait here in the silence
    Until you come and sit a while with me

    You raise me up, so I can stand on mountains
    You raise me up, to walk on stormy seas
    I am strong, when I am on your shoulders
    You raise me up, to more than I can be

    You raise me up, so I can stand on mountains
    Your raise me up, to walk on stormy seas
    I am strong, when I am on your shoulders
    You raise me up, to more than I can be

    Your raise me up, so I can stand on mountains (stand on mountains)
    You raise me up, to walk on stormy seas (stormy seas)
    I am strong, (I am strong), when I am on your shoulders (I am strong)
    You raise me up, to more than I can be

    You raise me up, so I can stand on mountains (stand on mountains)
    You raise me up, to walk on stormy seas (stormy seas)
    I am strong, when I am on your shoulders
    You raise me up, to more than I can be

    You raise me up, to more than I can be

  104. SFDBWV says:

    Looking deeper at Mart’s last comment/question as to whether a sign written in three languages, a crown of thorns, and two criminals hanging at Jesus’ left and right be hiding honor, goodness, glory far greater than two brothers, their mother, and the rest of the family ever imagined?

    The thrust of Jesus’ teaching is “selfless love”. Clearly here in this story we have people who as I said earlier are clueless as to what is about to happen, what it means and have yet to learn “selfless love”.

    Trying to figure out what might be hidden in the symbolic picture Mart has given, I have to look at the story of what occurs in those hours these three men are hanging on the hill.

    Hanging over the head of Jesus was the sign “Jesus of Nazareth the king of the Jews”. John 19:19 KJV
    The thief at Jesus’ right ask Jesus to remember him when Jesus comes into His Kingdom. Luke 23:42 KJV whereby Jesus assures him that that very day he would be with Jesus in paradise. Luke 23:43 KJV

    The other thief railed against Jesus saying if He is the Christ save Himself and them with Him. Luke 23:39

    The thief whom Jesus says would be with Him in Paradise rebukes the other for his comments and declares their guilt and Jesus’ innocence. Luke 23:40,:41 KJV

    Jesus gives up His own Spirit and so dies. Luke 23:46 KJV, but the other two’s legs are broken to quicken their deaths. John 19:31,:32 KJV

    The soldiers seeing Jesus already dead pierced Him with a spear and water and blood came out. John 19:33,:34 KJV

    Also before His death Jesus gave charge of the care of His mother to John. John 19:26,:27 KJV and declared His thirst whereupon He was given vinegar. John 19:28,:29 KJV

    What is hiding in this “picture” that these two brothers, their mother and the rest of the family ever imagined?

    65 degrees muggy and cloudy.

    Steve

  105. jeff1 says:

    Thinking that it is hard not to imagine the suffering that Jesus endured and though the two thieves suffered they were guilty of the crimes.

    When I accept Jesus as my Saviour then He becomes my substitute on the cross with the exception being that I am as guilty as the two thieves who did not lead a ‘selfless’ life.

    There is nothing hidden in the message of the gospel that Jesus took my punishment so that I am blameless before God.

    It is me forgetting this ‘truth’ that causes me to wander and it is God in His mercy that convicts me of my wandering because it is finished, I am His.

    It is my inability to see that God is glorious that causes me to falter. He must increase and I must decrease.

    I need Thee every hour,
    most gracious Lord;
    no tender voice like Thine
    can peace afford.

    Refrain:

    I need Thee, oh I need Thee,
    every hour I need Thee.
    O bless me now, my Saviour;
    I come to Thee.

    I need Thee every hour;
    stay Thou near by;
    temptations loose their power
    when Thou art nigh. (Refrain)

    I need Thee every hour,
    in joy or pain;
    come quickly and abide,
    or life is vain. (Refrain)

    I need Thee every hour;
    teach me Thy will;
    and Thy rich promises
    to me fulfil. (Refrain)

    I need Thee every hour,
    Most Holy One;
    O make me Thine indeed,
    Thou Blessed Son! (Refrain)

  106. poohpity says:

    N.T. Wright said, “James and John have been asking for the places at Jesus’s right and left so as to accompany him as he completes the glorious work of bringing in God’s kingdom. . . . But those places are reserved for the two who are crucified alongside him as he hangs there with “King of the Jews” above the head.”

    I do not think that the brothers or mother were asking to be on Jesus’s right or left as He brought in God’s kingdom but it seems to want to be in those places after the suffering from this world when He is actually sitting at the right hand of the Father in His kingdom. Jesus patiently said that they would drink the cup of suffering but the seating arrangements in the Kingdom of God was up to God. I would think the only reassurance that was needed was just the fact that one day they would be with Jesus in His Kingdom. That alone should have been enough.

    They would suffer for sharing the Gospel but they would not suffer from being the Savior of the world who knew no sin. I still do not know how Wright could conclude that has anything to do with the criminals hanging next to Jesus.

  107. poohpity says:

    Within that specific conversation Jesus said “When the ten heard about this, they became indignant with James and John. 42 Jesus called them together and said, “You know that those who are regarded as rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their high officials exercise authority over them. 43 Not so with you. Instead, whoever wants to become great among you must be your servant, 44 and whoever wants to be first must be slave of all. 45 For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”

    So the greatest place of honor was in service to others not wanting to be the leader but to be the servant.

  108. poohpity says:

    Who in this world fights over being a servant???

  109. poohpity says:

    There are however all kinds of fights about being first, being the highest on the totem pole, being the smartest, the most spirit filled or godly so much so that there are often several that get crushed beneath them on their way to the top.

  110. joycemb says:

    The gospel is the good news of gracious acceptance…Christians who trust in Christ for their acceptance with God, rather than in their own moral character, commitment, or performance, are simul iustus et peccator – simultaneously sinful yet accepted. We are more flawed and sinful than we ever dared believe, yet we are more loved and accepted than we ever dared hope at the same time.
    Tim Keller

  111. poohpity says:

    Boy that Tim Keller can really teach can’t he? Amen and Amen.

    I was cracking myself up thinking of the games they have on TV striving to be the winner and thinking of the opposite like what we are taught by Christ.

    “Who Wants to Be a Millionaire?” compared to “Who Wants to Give Their Millions Away?” I am sure y’all can come up with others. “Wheel of Fortune” compared to “Wheel of Suffering”.

  112. street says:

    “Who Wants to Be a Millionaire?” compared to “Who Wants to Give Their Millions Away?” I am sure y’all can come up with others. “Wheel of Fortune” compared to “Wheel of Suffering”.

    i like this, in the fact it brought 1 Corinthians 13 to mind. paul already mentioned the futility of theses games. we never get tired of the lust of the flesh and the pride of life, pleasure is easier to sell than suffering, but one taste of love and you will never be satisfied with anything else.

  113. joycemb says:

    “Most of God’s people are contented to be saved from the hell that is without; they are not so anxious to be saved from the hell that is within.” Robert Murray M’Cheyne

  114. joycemb says:

    Mart, I just read that Haddon died. My condolences to you and the ODB ministries family.

  115. foreverblessed says:

    Thanks you Joyce, for mentioning this.
    I saw the video that ODB has put on Facebook, about Haddon Robinson’s parting, it brought tears to my eyes, Haddon himself is talking, that he is ready to meet the Lord!
    Beautiful witness!!!

    ” Today, there is nothing in my life that interferes with the second coming of Jesus “

  116. SFDBWV says:

    I have for now 45 years taken care of our cemetery. Over those years I have been involved in the burial of many friends, associates, acquaintances and a few strangers.

    Death is never welcome.

    Even when it comes to the old, the disabled, the sick and suffering; the pain of losing someone to death is never a welcomed event.

    Yes during the few days before burial while perhaps laid out at the funeral home friends and family can gather, smile and even laugh as they remember the deceased. But death is a somber sad event.

    While some today will remember Haddon Robinson and say nice things about him. I will remember that we should always say nice things to people or about them while they live.

    My condolences to Haddon’s family and his friends.

    On Golgotha’s hill that day no one was happy to see these three men die, except for those who wanted them dead perhaps.

    No there was great sadness and confusion and certainly nothing glorious about the crucifixion. Not on that day.

    But “Joy comes in the morning” as on that resurrection day the tomb was empty and the glory of the cross and our story began.

    53 degrees this morning earlier, 61 as I write this.

    Blessings to all today.

    Steve

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