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Does Paul Move 2nd to 1st?

Window in English Anglo Catholic Church

Jesus said that love for God is the first and greatest commandment, and that the second most important is to love our neighbor as ourselves (Mark 12:30-31).

Moses anticipates such faithfulness to God when he says, as a matter of first importance, that Israel was to have no other god but the One who rescued them from Egypt (Exodus 20:1-3).

Then comes Paul. He seems to move the 2nd law of Israel and his Lord to 1st. In his letter to the Galatians he writes that all of the law is fulfilled in one word: love your neighbor as yourself (Gal 5:14).

Yesterday, we talked about a book I read on self-deception. The author’s point was that we betray our own lack of virtue when we fail to do what we can to help someone else. Since the book seems to take a more humanistic approach (without mention of God), are we to conclude that, in a similar way, Paul may have taken a more “modern” approach than Jesus or Moses?

Or, as some have suggested, did Paul just find another way of saying the same thing? Or is Paul’s point to the Galatians different than that of Jesus and Moses?


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54 Responses to “Does Paul Move 2nd to 1st?”

  1. marinicheerful says:

    So, i feel puzzled. What is the conclusion? please give some more insights. :) thnx

  2. SFDBWV says:

    Personally I do not see any confusion in the matter. God wrote 10 basic commandments and throughout all of the teaching concerning law, we conclude that any violation of the law is seen as the same.

    Obedience to the law begins with placing God as #1 and yourself as under His authority.

    However is that love?

    To love God means to see Him as He really is, a loving Creator who, as Jesus opened for us, we can call Abba or Father.

    If we love someone do we not want to please them?

    Once we fuse that love into our nature we can understand that loving others as we love ourselves is the desired goal of God for us.

    The two become one.

    To love your neighbor as you love yourself is to love God and show it.

    Steve

    Cool foggy and damp in the mountains.

  3. florida7sun says:

    Love your neighbor as yourself is impossible in the flesh. We can only love God and our neighbor through death to self and the indwelling of His Holy Spirit that brings life and light to our physical being.

    Apart from Him we can do nothing that is righteous.

    His life within us brings honor to Our Father and the capacity to love ourselves and our neighbor. The Word was made flesh, so that our flesh could magnify and glorify the Word of His Being.

    To do so, we need His daily bread to live an abundant life.

    The love of Our Father is so pure it returns to Him through His Spirit in hearts born anew. That unadulterated love brings assurance through faith that radiates His light.

    The light of I AM cannot be contained or restrained, but is freely expressed to our neighbor in the person of Jesus. In the Name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit, we are one body in Christ.

    Fog burning off this morning. Headed to 92 degrees today, and NOAA forecasts an active hurricane season.

    Ray

    Praying for the peace of Jerusalem and His peace throughout the world.

  4. bratimus says:

    In Mark 12:30-31

    Jesus say the second greatest commandment is to love your neighbor as you love yourself. This was told to the Pharissees and scribes when they questioned Jesus on the commandment or law of God.

    In John 13:34 Jesus says this “A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another.”

    Jesus said this to the disciples at the last supper after Judas left.

    What Jesus said in Mark 12:30-31 was to people that only had love for themselves and wouldn’t undertsand to love one another as God has loved you.

    What Paul wrote in Gal. 5:14 is what the people knew that Jesus spoke through word of mouth. And I think what Paul was meaning in the Fulfilling the law is
    If you Obay the first but don’t apply the second there is no fulfillment of the Love.

    The Pharissees and scribes claimed to Obey the first but never fulfilled the love by loving others they only had love for themselves and never knew the love that Christ showed them.

    Thes are my thoughts on this and putting my thoughts into words sometimes is like learning another language.

  5. Mart De Haan says:

    bratimus,

    I think you are on to it. The resolution seems to be in the idea and word “fulfill.” Paul’s point shows us that the first commandment is fulfilled (or brought to completeness) in the second.

    James seems to make a similar point in his discussion of faith and works. Faith is fulfilled (brought to completeness) in works (James 2:22-23).

  6. SFDBWV says:

    The dictionary defines love as a deep and tender feeling of affection for, or attachment, or devotion to a person or persons. It also defines love as God’s benevolent concern for mankind and man’s devout attachment to God.

    One meaning of love from the Strong’s Concordance explains love as a strong affection.

    Love as I understand it is the most free of all things. It cannot be demanded it cannot be expected, it cannot be forced upon another nor can it be received without a willful act from the receiver. Freely offered, freely received.

    We created beings share that one thing, free will. We are not automatons that only love God because God forces us to or in some mystic way enables us to through His infinite power. Rather it is a free decision He allows for us to make on our own.

    Apparently Angels have this same free will, as we are told that 1/3 of them decided not to accept God as the ultimate source of love.

    To demonstrate our affection for God, first of all we believe Him. Believing Him is an act of trust; by that one simple act we demonstrate our love for God.

    All of the reasons that Cain felt and expressed in the killing of his brother Abel, are contrary to the nature of God and align themselves with that same nature of those angels whom rebelled and rejected God’s authority and love.

    The fallen state of Man, places all of mankind in the same company with fallen angels, but God Himself decided to make a way for mankind to be forgiven through His own sacrifice so as to allow mankind not to be forced to share the same fate as those fallen angels. The ultimate act of love from the author of love.

    It is no wonder angels look at this matter called grace with awe and wonder.

    God so loves man that He offers mankind a choice, a second chance at returning to that prefallen condition between He and man.

    If we love God then we demonstrate that love by not aligning ourselves with the emotions of sin, but rather His emotion of love for mankind, and thus love our neighbor.

    A free and willful act and choice made by man.

    Steve

  7. Toml5169 says:

    John also gives insight throughout the book of 1st John. After talking extensively about loving God, God loving us, and loving others John sums up his thoughts by stating if we can’t love our brother who we see how can we ever be lovers of God who we can’t see.
    No rain today in Portland!

  8. oneg2dblu says:

    This is not a chapter and verse quote, but it is a God-given word, and as true as it gets…
    “He who is deviod of the power of forgive, is deviod of the power to love.” MLK jr.
    Both of those righteous attributes, may be spoken, or authored by a man, but come directly from God!
    Against such things there is no law. Gary

  9. oneg2dblu says:

    I don’t know if anyone else saw this connection, but there is a “number” that we use to relate to Satan.
    I found it revealed today, in the ODB message that appears in the reading the bible in one year. It is in John 6:66, we read about those disciples who no longer Follow Christ. We know from the reading that Christ knew they would fall away, and not Follow Him!
    I’m not really into any numbers thing , but this one hit me, as very telling though! Gary

  10. foreverblessed says:

    Here is what I think:
    Paul writes to people who are afraid they are not obeying the 10 commandments when they live in faith in Chirst.
    He reassures them: do not worry,
    I do not think that Paul went further then Christ did,
    because Jesus Himself went further then Mark 12:30-31
    as Bratimus wrote, in John 13:34 a new commandment I give you….

    I think if we follow Jesus, at first we are concerned about keeping the commandments,
    But after a while it begins to dawn upon us, that Jesus wants to take us many many steps further then the 10 commandments:
    He says: love your neighbour as I have loved you,
    that is far beyond “love your neighbour as yourself.”

  11. poohpity says:

    I do not think that Paul was saying anything different than Jesus or Moses both put the love of God at the for front for us and everyone. The worshiping in awe of who God is what makes the other commandment possible.

    In Galatians Paul seemed to be confronting legalism by heaping rules on themselves and others while not understanding that the freedom they have in Christ is what was needed to love and serve each other. (Gal 5:13). They were no longer living that out but were being critical and catty which was ruining each other rather spurring each other to good works.(Gal 5:15)

    Paul went on to explain what behaviors showed they were neglecting God and others in Gal 5:20,21. Paul did not leave it there but went on to show what it looks like in a persons life who has put the greatest commandment first that of loving God above all else which will result in Gal 5:22,23.

  12. royalpalm says:

    To fulfill means to bring to completion or reality; achieve or realize. So, I think Paul was not contradicting what Moses or Jesus considered as the first commandment but rather Paul was saying that the reality and proof of one’s love for God is shown in how he loves his neighbor. Jesus and Paul showed us that our love for God and the knowledge of His love should compel us to die to ourselves to share the good news about the One who loved them and died for them while they were still sinners.

    2 Corinthians 5:14 “For the love of Christ compels us, because we judge thus: that if One died for all, then all died; 15 and He died for all, that those who live should live no longer for themselves, but for Him who died for them and rose again.”

    Romans 5:8 ” But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.”

  13. oneg2dblu says:

    foreverblessed… 5-20 10:07 you say, and I agree, that Christ came not to take away the law, as much as He came to bring it into an even higher calling, or fulfillment, by saying, Once you accept His Calling, He is in the picture of your life, and your new higher requirenments, are never going to be met without Him!
    Being under the law alone, was just failure after failure, but being in Him, is only accomplished, as we Obey all that He commands! Above and beyond any list of TEN, we can never satisfy… comes this new command that we now can! Gary

  14. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    It is so simple! Steve got it right, sorry Steve!

    Jesus said in parables etc. “If you do it to the least of these you do it unto me”.

    In other words if you love your neighbour as yourself you are loving ME, I AM, Jesus Messiah.
    That is our Servant God, that IS Jesus!

    To love the Lord your God with all your Heart, Soul, Mind and Strength IS to love your neigbour as yourself. But then you say “self is dead”
    So who is loving your neighbour, I AM, that is Jesus.

    The poetry and majesty of it all is endless!

    Bob

  15. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    So Paul understood that, that is why he could say:
    “that all of the law is fulfilled in one word: love your neighbour as yourself (Gal 5:14).”

    Jesus said I have come to Fulfil the Law and the Prophets.

    Such simplicity can only come from The Father!

  16. tracey5tgbtg says:

    John also touched on this when he said, “If anyone says, “I love God,” yet hates his brother, he is a liar. For anyone who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot love God, whom he has not seen.” 1 John 4:20

    This does say brother, which I think means fellow believer, whereas a neighbor is whoever you come in contact with and they may not necessarily be a believer.

    But clearly the Bible tell us we must love people and I admit, that can sometimes be hard. The only way to do so is to love God first, with everything within you.

    Some of the people I have felt most close to are people who initially rubbed me the wrong way, but I took those feelings to God and prayed for them and for me and thanked God for placing them in my life, and I can honestly say that my heart for them changed.

    The more I had to rely on God in order to love someone, the more easily I found that I could.

    And the more I had to rely on God to love my neighbor, the more of God’s love I felt in my heart.

  17. poohpity says:

    I think Peter also agreed when he said in 1 Peter 4:8 “Most important of all, continue to show deep love for each other, for love makes up for many of your faults.” It goes back to the description of love in 1 Cor 13 where it states that love hardly notices when it is done wrong and expects the best from others. It just really touches my heart and makes me stand in awe of our God because that is what is done for us. That kind of love would bring about a heart to give it back.

  18. polet says:

    To my understanding, Paul’s point is still the Love for God 1st and to love thy neighbor at 2nd. for how can we love others if not Loving and accepting God in our lives first.

  19. Regina says:

    Good Evening All

    Off topic here…
    Well, according to the guy who predicted the LORD’s return tomorrow, we have a few minutes… a few hours before The Rapture (or Armageddon) takes place. Wonder what time he (his followers included) was expecting the LORD’s return? Will be midnight in 17 minutes! Pretty sure they’re gonna be in for a rude awaking. Jesus said no man knows the day or the hour of His return, only our Heavenly Father knows, and, if you ask me, for good reason.

    Very overcast and rainy in Texas today (68 degrees right now).

    Blessings to all,

  20. Regina says:

    *awakening

  21. Regina says:

    Want to share my thoughts on Mart’s comment, “Jesus said that love for God is the first and greatest commandment, and that the second most important is to love our neighbor as ourselves (Mark 12:30-31). …did Paul just find another way of saying the same thing? Or is Paul’s point to the Galatians different than that of Jesus and Moses?”

    I think Paul’s point is different from Jesus and Moses because he admonished believers to love their neighbors as they loved “themselves,” not as they loved the LORD their God. As believers in Christ, we *should not* love ourselves more than we love God.

  22. onesimos says:

    It seems there is no conflict: 1 John 5:3a: This is love for God, that we obey His commands. 1 John 3:23: And this is His command, to believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and to love one another as He commanded us.

  23. SFDBWV says:

    Maybe the world did end today, as it isn’t raining.

    However if there is a tomorrow, it has the promise of more rain.

    It is OK Bob, I like to keep things simple, no need to complicate something that is so easy to understand on its own.

    Steve

  24. tracey5tgbtg says:

    Tom\5169 – After reading through the posts, I see that you also had mentioned 1 John. Didn’t mean to copy your post. I do try to read everyone’s thoughts eventually, it just takes me some time.

  25. poohpity says:

    Gosh darn, I am still here. Oh well it was just ,our time yet. Shows to go ya don’t it. When we think we think we know, God will always let us know His ways are far beyond our ways.

    I was thinking this morning why it is so important to put God first in our mind, hearts and souls because it is by His example that we need follow. If you think about it Jesus had all authority, power, supreme intelligence and holiness yet displayed humility, servant hood, sacrifice, mercy and acceptance to such an undeserving lot because of His love for us. What He could of done to us and did not is so utterly amazing. With one word, just one word He could have said this group of humans does not deserve to breathe another breath and wiped us all out but He wanted us to understand what true love is, the ability to allow someone to grow and mature and have a relationship with the God of all creation. How could we not want to share that with others?

    So that second commandment is a reflection of our understanding the first. Not until we truly get the first and realize that the glory goes to God for living through us to others. It would be nice if we could just be told how to act but that does not always work if we do not understand what that is supposed to look like then we are left with our own interpretation which often gets us into a lot of trouble. Ya got to have some type of foundation to build on and what could be better than the example that Jesus gave us.

  26. SFDBWV says:

    I admit it; I am disappointed that that fellow who predicted yesterday was the date of the Rapture was wrong. I certainly would not have cared if he was right, let him be right.

    However it shows the foolishness of such ventures and the harm it does our religion, and to some perhaps their faith.

    I went yesterday to newseum and found a large story concerning it in the Augusta GA. Newspaper, interestingly the printed word for word from the scripture the words of Jesus telling us all that no one knows the time or day of the event.

    So from it all there is still the opportunity for some to hear the truth.

    47 degrees and cloudy this morning, expecting rain to return today.

    Steve

  27. SFDBWV says:

    Out in my back yard there is two old purple rhododendrons, they are both casualties of years of being attacked by the deer. Last winter was the worst they have been treated, one nearly bare this spring of any leaves as the deer had eaten every leaf and bud last winter.

    As I was out amongst them this morning I thought about how I have been anxious to prune it back and cut off the dead ends so as to make the bushes look better and help its growth.

    Yet as I look some of the ends of what looks dead wood are starting to push out little fragments of fresh green leaves, I have watched this plant strain all spring to spring back from what looks like hopeless dead sticks, to life.

    Each day I have wanted to go ahead and start cutting it back, but each day I see a little new grown trying to make its way out.

    This morning, it reminded me of God and His time for the rapture and end of the age of man.

    I wonder if just when He thinks now is the time, he sees a little new spurt of hope and decides to put it off just a little while longer….Like me and the plant, it takes love and patience and a will for it to live.

    Steve

  28. xrgarza says:

    Mart,

    Paul was in essence teaching the Galatians how to live their lives in such a way that would allow them not to have any other gods be more important than the one true God.

    Paul knew that we are all selfish people, and if we could love one another as we love ourselves we would actually be demonstrating Gods love.

    No other god could ever have us demonstrate that kind of emotion towards anyone else.

    By loving your neighbor as yourself you are actually doing what the one true God would desire for you to do, thus being obedient to Him at such a level indicates that you have not made any other god be more important the one true God.

    Rocky

  29. poohpity says:

    Thank God that he is not hesitant to prune us when we need it. To cut back that old stuff so that it will not hinder the nutrients from the vine from going into the branches more swiftly which will produce better fruit. With my kids it was so hard to say it is time for you to do for yourself. I wanted so bad to keep doing for them but they needed to be pruned. It was hard because I wanted to control and be the one they looked to for help but that stunted their growth. Loving them also means it is time to let go, very hard to do but they are now starting to see they are able to do more than they could living with me. Not only can they see but frankly now I can see that they can spread their wings and start flying on their own. Being pruned is not always easy but the results are good. Loving is doing the tough things sometimes.

  30. dodi says:

    A lawyer once asked Christ what is the greatest commandment? Christ said “to love the Lord w/ your heart, mind, soul, strength and your neighbor as yourself and on these two commandments alone >hang all the law and the prophets< Matt:22:40
    By this all men shall know that you are my disciples if you have love one for another. In the writings of Josephus the Jewish Historian it was said of the Apostle John (the desciple whom Jesus loved) John said "if this alone be done, love is the surpreme ruling of divine grace in one's heart)sacrifical love is the ultimate…..no greater love than this that a man lay down his life for his friend / without love (I am nothing)Love in the face of insults, injuries, rejection it can only be done through divine grace, my husband once said" Love is God's vengence" ________

  31. SFDBWV says:

    Thank you dodi for your warmth and wisdom. I like your husband.

    Steve

  32. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    Don’t ask me why I am awake 3am UK time, I just am!

    Not much to say at this time of day.
    We had a good speaker at Church today who talked about the Jewish way of worshiping God while we work and that there is no distintion between work, in a secutar sense, and God.
    He used the example of a slave in Africa cleaning toilets and as I clean toilets in Cornwall it spoke to me and blessed me.

    Keep working for God!

    Bob

  33. Regina says:

    Good Evening All

    Overcast and rainy in Texas today and raining as I type this comment. Hope you’re all having an awesome weekend. The highlight of my weekend was being able to fellowship with other believers today at church. The visiting Pastor who brought the sermon said that he was as happy as a mosquito in a nudist colony to be at our church! lol! Want to share some words of wisdom that he shared with us:
    1. Sight is a function of the eyes, but vision is a function of the heart.
    2. God always changes people, then uses people to change circumstances and situations.
    3. Everything that happens in our lives is either “God sent” or “God used.”
    4. We can’t just honor the knowledge of the moment and ignore the wisdom of the ages.
    5. You don’t have to choose between God or money, you only have to choose which one you’re going to serve.

    Want to end with a quote that he shared with us…

    “The future will be very kind to me because I intend to create it.” ~ Winston Churchill

    Love to all,
    Regina

  34. nezzar says:

    Just a couple of thoughts, forgive me if I reinterate what others have said.

    Reading some of the posts has reminded me of a book I got from this organization a few years ago called religion or relationship. (I tried to find it again, but I guess its out of print.) I talked about how when God came out of the clouds on mount siani with miraculous signs and wonders the people told Moses to go to Him and just tell them what to do. They couldn’t immagine a relationship with such an awsome God so they chose religion (law) instead. Jesus came back to restore us to relationship with Him. If you are in a relationship there is no need for law, because we now have the Holy Spirit to tell us moment by moment how to love Him.

    Jesus is also showing me that not only are we to have a relationship with God, but also to those around us. if we loving others it is impossible not to make a relationship. By forging relationships with those around us it becomes impossible to not love them. By loving others we show God love. I think that is what Paul was getting at.

    Love starts with God loving us. We can not love God properly unless we understand at least in part His love for us. As we come to understand His love for us more we love Him more. Out of this relationship comes our love for others.
    have to finnish later be right back.

  35. nezzar says:

    Once we see God loving others through us we see our selves doing God’s work and we like what we see, because God has transformed us, to be more like Him.

    This is the opposite of what some would say “love your neighbor as yourself that means you have to love yourself first.” That is the exact opposite of what the bible actually teaches.

    As for those who believed that the world would end two days ago, their lack of checking the scripture to see if it was true is actually a sin! They robbed themselves and God of credabillity by being a part of this nonsense. If they repent they will be forgiven, but they will have to pay the consiquences of thier actions. If they sold a house or gave up children, because the world was ending, they will have to bare the consiquences. I pray for all those who turn from God because of their disalusionment with this one movement. It is possible for the man who started it all to be forgiven however he will have to pay the consiquences for all sin commited because of his falsehood. I hope that he repents, but he’ll probablelly just come up with another date. Woe to him, if he does. I pray for God’s mercy on him and that he be lead to repentance.

  36. SFDBWV says:

    Prayers for the people of Joplin Missouri.

    Steve

  37. Bob in Cornwall England says:

    Saw it on the 1 o’clock news Steve,
    Aweful Twister and so large.

    I have been to Missoouri and have some old friends there.
    They are all in my prayers today.

    It seems the whole central plains area from Canada down is getting bad weather. The terrible thing about Tornadoes is you never quite know where and when they will strike.

    Bob

  38. oneg2dblu says:

    good morning all… today is the last day of regular school, but my kids will still need all their ongoing therapy, so its off to summer school, in a week for them, and me as well.
    I spotted a rather large gator, as in over five feet, this morning in small canal I drive by every day. God is always presenting His Glory of Creation, in the most unexpected places! We only need to be aware it is His Magnificence, created all for His Glory!
    Part of His Creation… are His manifestations of Himslef, as a full living man in Jesus Christ,and as a full living spirit, in the Holy Spirit! Each one created as a separate and distint Personhood of His
    Being.
    To Law has no life of its own, as a living Slave is to His Master, so we cannot be under it, and serve it. But with the Personhood, and Indwelling, of the Holy Spirit, do we become Under God’s Living Law!
    It is the spirit within us, that shows us what laws we break, what laws we allow to change us, and what laws we should be under.
    Being Ruled by this Holy Spirit, is the total freedom of being under God’s Law without Condemnation in Christ Jesus, but with Spiritual Conviction, and there is no law against such things, if we Obey that Conviction of the Holy Spirit, we are Obeying the Law of God given to each of us! Freedom to Serve, Freedom to Forgive, Freedom to Love as God Loves. If we just Obey that God-given Spirit within, then, We have Overcome the World! Be Blessed, Gary

  39. poohpity says:

    When did it all become just words? When did our faith become quotes from the bible? When did our love for God become real enough to trust Him for everything? When did our love for God just become words spoken to appease the listening crowds that we know what to say and when to say it but it is just all words?

  40. poohpity says:

    My oldest son went to school in Joplin at Ozark Christian College for his freshman year. When I took him there the whole town pretty much shut down on Sunday. It was one of the most beautiful towns I have ever seen and all the people we came in contact with were just lovely of heart.

    It seems like destruction upon destruction is happening all over the world. Father I pray for mercy and restoration, help us to be your hands and feet in all these heart breaking events around the world. In your precious son’s name I pray, Amen!!

  41. bratimus says:

    My earlier post i was trying to point out what nezzar mention as loving ur neighbor as yourself, being opposite from what God teaches through His words.

    In Mark 12:30-31 Jesus is speaking to the Pharissees and scribes that are testing Jesus in asking what the greatest commandment is. What Jesus said to them todays youth would say that Jesus did a word smack down on them. Jesus was pointing out their self centered lives and to complete the law of God they would have to love others as much as their selves. Not recognizing the Christ right in front of them as they questioned Jesus. They didn’t know the love of God or put God first.

    in John 13:34 Jesus tells his disciples the new commandment to love one another as I have loved you. they know the Christ they know the love.

    So as followers as Christ we are suppose to love one another as God has loved us.

    Paul said or wrote what he di in Gal. 5:14 thes is what the people knew what Christ said through word of mouth as Christianity grew before the printed Bible.

    On one hand we are lucky to be able to have the Bible at hand. But on the other hand how much does that take away from the out spoken testamony and witnessing as the apostles did at the beinning of Christianity.

    In the U.S. with free press and freedom of speech, most conversation will be about politics and events of the day. With only a little of God because a man predicting the end of the world.

    Hope this makes sense my allergies are bad this year.

    The gator and the croc in some cultures in history were refered to as serpents, because on land they look as if they were crawling with their belly’s in the dirt.

  42. nezzar says:

    bratimus

    I love that term “a word smack down.” The Gator and croc thing is interesting too.

  43. nezzar says:

    Just to clarify: What I meant was not so much that love your neighbor as yourself was wrong, but having to love yourself first. Because that statement gets everything backwards. We do NOT love our selves first; we love ourselves last. God’s Love is always first. Our love for Him next then our love for others. Lastly our love for ourselves. This must be the kind of love that brings forth action. All the warm feelings in the world wont keep the poor warm. Happy thoughts or positive thinking wont help, but feeding the homeless will. I hope that no one thinks these are just empty words.

  44. foreverblessed says:

    Nezzar, thanks, not they are not empty words at all!!
    Thank you for your words!
    have been out a few days, a lot to read up.
    One thought that is afcourse so logical:
    If we have died to our old self, Jesus is now living in us, so He loves others through me.
    I must admit, that I have to give Jesus my all, many times I, the old me, is in the way.
    Paul wrote: For me to live is Christ – in Philippians 1:21
    And that is my aim too.

  45. foreverblessed says:

    Pray for these people who have been misguided. Pray for them, that Gods love may surround them, and lead them.
    People can be very sincere, and yet misled, but God who is graceful can bring people back from where they were. As He has done to me too. Thanks to God.

  46. bratimus says:

    nezzar,

    Well basically Jesus put the wisdom of God against the wisdom of man in all his parables and words against the testing of the law they put him through. So it was a wrestling match of words. How many times did the Pharissees and scribes have to walk away after they went toe to toe with Jesus with words so The word smack down sounds about right. Even when the disciples didn’t fully understand Jesus words He would explain what He meant because they believed on Him. God will always give us the answer even if we don’t understand at first as long as we believe on Him.

    Jesus was good at pointing out the leaders of the temples faults with in His answers. So in saying to love your neighbors as you love yourself, was pointing out to the leaders of the temple that they were self center and used the laws for there own dominence.

    I rather try to love others as God has love me, that is unconditional love. Which i do admit is hard at times, because some people are so in love with themselves there is no room for any other love.

  47. poohpity says:

    When I was talking about empty words when it comes to love the example I will give you is what I experienced this weekend. The pastor we have had for the last 9 and half years and the three before him over the 22 years I have attended were totally eaten up with critical spirits and ripped apart and spit out by well meaning Christians who thought they knew how the church should be run. They say they love but from what I saw and heard judgment and caddy criticism were what was displayed. The pastor was a very good teacher but as soon as one walked into the foyer they complained about the music, the pastor’s hair, the behavior of his grown son’s who had also have been judged so severely they chose another church and then complained about the decisions that the elders and staff made after they were chosen to lead by those same members. Now how is that loving, building up or encouraging them to be better.

    I have always understood to love others as yourself to mean, if I was in the position of that person what would I like for someone to do for me, then do it for them. There is nothing at all wrong with that. A person can not give away what they do not have. What I see in empty words are those and I include myself in that it seems after a while we grow rusty at giving love out and come to a stage where it turns to putting ourselves in God’s place as a judge not in the place of giving out as much grace and mercy as we have been shown. I was just wondering this morning when does it get turned around and what happens to us to bring us to that place.

  48. poohpity says:

    People often display behaviors that maybe hard to love but really those are the ones who need it the most. They may have been really hurt and have learned to put walls up for protection. The one fact remains that no matter how anyone may act we all need love, acceptance and belonging and those who may act the worse are those who need it the most.

  49. poohpity says:

    Paul reminds us in Eph 4:29-32 29 Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen. 30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. 31 Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, brawling and slander, along with every form of malice. 32 Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you. Also Ehp 4:2,3 2 Be completely humble and gentle; be patient, bearing with one another in love. 3 Make every effort to keep the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace.

    That is what I call loving another without empty words. When I speak to someone are my words going to show the Love of Christ. For what is in my heart will come pouring out of my mouth.

  50. oneg2dblu says:

    pooh… I liked your “when and how” questions. When it comes to being able to love others, as Christ has loved us, and how really making our words, become our walk!
    I feel it can only happen when we are truly, totally surrendered to Living for Him, instead of living for our own design and desires.
    When you were out in the mission field, and on task every day doing His Work, using our mouth, feet, and hands, that is when. Having been led by the Holy Spirit within, and not led by self motivation, is the how!
    But, we are not always given to escape our daily routines, and scramble with a group of same believers to another place in the world, specifically to evangelise or help others. We have our daily walk to endure, and our daily tasks to busy ourselves, but we do steal away some very preciuos moments every day, if we practice this life building relationship with Our Master! We become the sheep of His Desire, when we Hear His Voice, and Obey His Words! When we simply, “come” to his calling,we are under his protection, his provision, then we find ourselves caught up in following and praising Him.
    When? When He calls! How? Only through His Grace, and His Direction, do we ever follow something other than our own way!
    But, you knew all that because you’ve Loved Him, as He has Loved you, when you Believed and Surrendered your will for His Love, you became His Possession! Gary :)

  51. poohpity says:

    To me every day I am in the mission field. Not just when I was in Africa telling all those lost souls about Christ but when my eyes open every morning I feel like I am His ambassador to everyone I come in contact with. There were just more at the time who accepted Christ in Africa but here it seems to be seed spreading and watering. I really wish I were better at it, I still have so much to learn.

  52. foreverblessed says:

    Pooh, “A person can not give away what they do not have” so the first thing we have to do each morning is to be filled with His love for us. If we are wearied during the day,
    go back and seek God’s face till we are filled, and totally calm again, adn at peace with Him. Then we can go back and face our fellow humans.

    And how long does it take me to learn that?
    But we often do not go to God, we go to our fellow himan beings and want to be filled by them.
    Instead of going to Jesus first, He is our first love and our last. Our Alpha and Omega,
    and I pray these be not empty words.
    I like singing these words in hymns, they make me focus on where to go.

  53. foreverblessed says:

    Have been thinking a bit more in the line of us surrendering totally to Jesus: then it is Jesus loving through us, when we say love others as yourself, or rather:love others as Jesus has loved us, the second command.

    God is our Father, He loves us and we love Him, the first command.

    The Jerusalem above is our Mother, Galatians 4:26
    Maybe the second command is that love of a Mother, Jesus’ love working through us in faith from one to another,

    The church then should be like a loving Mother, where the children are nourished and well kept. But as we children are impferfect, and often acting like 3 year olds who want to have our way, and so no perfect family. But in God’s grace we ever grow more and more in love.

  54. mannyjesus2 says:

    Isn’t it that the Bible says that we are all equal, regardless of statues? It don’t matter who we are, where we’re from (low/high)? Isn’t Jesus God also (John 1), that he is first and that we should put others in need above us, then we follow? We should always humble ourselves and let God be first and not make our own judgment to who’s next.

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